cyccommute 

That's a different kind of "touring" than what you are talking about. A bike with a 425mm chainstay is a relatively short bike that has quicker handling at the expense of pannier carrying capacity. Even people with small feet and small panniers would have problems with heel strike...where the heel hits the bag on each revolution. It's not that much of a problem but it is annoying.

More importantly, to avoid the heel strike, the load has to be pushed further back. If the load to pushed back too far and is too heavy, the load causes the steering to become unpredictable. I call it "the tail wagging the dog". A very large load on the rear can even lift the front wheel slightly so that the bike's steering becomes vague and/or the bike develops a "death wobble" where the front shimmies uncontrollably especially at high speeds. Most people don't like death wobbles.

For the best loaded bike handling, the load should be inside the wheelbase, i.e. mounted forward of the axles on the rear and behind the axles on the front. This is usually not entirely possible because you'd have an impossibly long bike that would handle too sluggishly. Compromises are made on classic touring bikes to mount center the luggage load over the axles. This reduces the tail wagging significantly.

Sorta. Don't pay too much attention to the chainstay length for fit purposes. It's important for the above reasons. A bike that is small is proportioned so that the frame is small all the other parameters. A 43cm road bike, for example, is going to be proportionally smaller in top tube length, standover and handlebar reach than a 49 cm road bike or a 58 cm road bike.

In mountain bikes convert to the English system and subtract 3" (5ish cm). A 49cm road bike rider would require a 15" (38cm) mountain bike. Someone who rides a 43cm bike (probably your girlfriend's size) would need a 13" mountain bike (with 26" wheels).

The chainstays of either bike might be longer or shorter depending on the manufacturer. Most of the bikes I see use the same chainstay no matter what size the bike is. The Trek FX, for example, has 44.5cm chainstays for all 4 bike sizes from 13" to 19".

The FX is worth looking at for your girlfriend, by the way. Yes, it has flat bars but it is also not a bad touring geometry. Long wheel base, longish chainstays and rack mounts front and rear. It's a good place to start.

cyccommute 

Fixed it.

fixedweasel

cyccommute. Holy smokes dude. Please Stop. Giving advice. That is 100% incorrect.* I was wincing in pain just reading your inexperienced responses. Seriously, we are on here to give folks good/proper advice. They are here to learn from others who are experienced and to learn from other folks mistakes. Don't give him bad advice. I have my own shop and have fit numerous riders. I know exactly how to fit someone. You cannot even understand the principle that saddle to bar drop can also work the other way.........you know........with the bars higher than the saddle. You cannot even understand how a bike's geometry effects the reach, and that a taller headtube will help put the rider in a better/more upright position without having 12" of stem sticking out of the headset. I'd have to go back a page and address the other poor comments but I think folks get the point.




*referring to your response in my post

veganbikes

Uhhhhh Loctite and Rotofix, bro! I don't want to get into another argument about it but pot meet kettle.

bikebasket

Thanks again people.

Just looked at the Trek FX on the web. Yeah, that looks like the type of thing i'm after.

The girlfriend was actually riding on some of Sihanoukville's busiest roads yesterday! She has VERY limited experience on bikes so R.E.S.P..E.C.T. I'm not sure i will ever understand the road logic here. Thank god shes not learning to ride in Phnom Penh. LOL.
The kind french man nextdoor has let her use his folding city style bike. I noticed that the steering was very light on it so it should be good training for her. She actually fell off it yesterday after going one handed, but no harm done.

I reckon getting her a bike will be fairly easy, but myself not so. For her, even if the bike is a full on alu framed MTB, i'm thinking that as long as the saddle can be put level with the handlebars and she can get full leg extension at the end of the downstroke, and not leaning too far forward - sorted.
She has actually told me she would like a sloping down top tube as it makes her feel more secure i think, so maybe the decision has already been made to get her an alu framed MTB, and they look quite decent.

Right now, i think i'll try and get a trailer for my bike, as even though i suspect going downhill on it could be a chore relatively speaking. Reasons ;

a) It will take the load of the frame, allowing me a much more wider choice of an already limited choice.
b) I can carry/tow everything making it much easier handling for the GF.
c) It will slow me down, making it much safer for the GF/less stressful for me.
d) We can travel in more luxury, with things like decent size cooking pots, fishing rods, hammocks...bottle of gin..24 case of beer etc.

saddlesores

and don't forget the kitchen sink!

indyfabz

But no jeans. They cause hypothermia.

saddlesores

oh, my gosh! it's not just jeans, but anything cotton.
even cotton blends with less than 25% cotton will kill you!
you should check out whiteblasé.nerd for the truth about fabrics.
in fact, i think i'll head over there now and see what's up.



of course, everything in moderation, am i right? you can still survive,
fashionably, with one of these cotton accordion turbans under your helmet,
as long as you balance it out with plastic or tinfoil underwear.

LeeG

A person isnt a ruler so there isn’t one important dimension. What is important is your prefered posture which is determined by the location of the seat, bars(hand location) and bottom bracket. Seat to bars distance then bar height. Type of bars, type of seat, seat tube angle can shift the above a little but basically you should be able to get on a bike and know what feels right from lots of time on the bike then take those measurements with you when looking around.

So if you’re looking at a touring frame with a long top tube compared to a previous bike get a shorter stem assuming the posture felt right on the previous bike.

rhm

Wheel size.

This is only an issue if the front wheel is too big; but that is often the case with a small woman. If the front wheel is too big, the handlebar will be too high, the bottom bracket will (probably) be too high, and the top tube will be too long.

fixedweasel

Sorry, my friend....................experience............you cannot get around it. Please don't speak of things you know nothing about. Unless you've rebuilt/converted as many bikes as I have using this method for a SPECIFIC purpose, you don't have a leg. Only reply to this if you have actual real world experience with the proper technique of converting this way and then we can discuss it.* It's amazing how folks look for good/educated/researched/experienced/evidenced based/intelligent/well versed information and when they finally get it, they troll. Grow up.




*in the instances i have converted the proper way, I have never had a cog loosen with only one exception. it was my 225 pound brother skidding all over the place and it finally broke loose after a year and a half**
**and i NEVER convert this way with a bike that is treated that way......he purposely wanted to really test it to see how long it would actually hold.

Siu Blue Wind

Lets play nice in here please.

veganbikes

You cannot give out advice to someone and complain to someone else about their advice giving when potentially both of you could be giving similar advice.

I would certainly hope nobody does anything potentially unsafe to their bike no matter what anecdotal evidence someone might provide on it. We have proper tools and methods for many things in the bike world for good reason. Any Individual can choose to or not to use those tools and methods but we as responsible cyclists and people who seek out our advice should promote those tools and methods. Amongst our fellow mechanics we might say something different and do things to our own bicycles that do not follow those tools or methods.

I have no ill feelings towards you @fixedweasel and I still do not want to debate fixed gear cog securement because there is no need. My point was we should not tell our fellow forum mates they are giving bad advice if we could be doing the same. We can and should certainly help point them in better directions or provide evidence of more empirical nature.

As for growing up, I am a Toys R Us kid and if I grew up then I would no longer be a Toys R Us kid and that would be sad. Growing up is boring, dealing with IRAs and various payments and back pain isn't how I want to spend my life. It is a sad fact of life but I say we need to have more fun and be a kid again every once and a while

fietsbob

Sorry if its not simple, one thing, Fit is more than one parameter.

.. Carry On..

cyccommute 

I'm far from "inexperienced". I've made plenty of mistakes and, being married to a petite woman for more than 40 years, have learned an awful lot about fitting bikes to people who aren't in the middle of the size distribution. Most people are never going to have a problem with fitting a bike. If you are close to the average male or average female in size, you can likely walk into a shop and find something that will fit inside of 10 minutes. If you are taller than average, you might be limited but are still more likely to find something in your "size" more easily than if you fall off the other end of the distribution curve.

Small people, like Bike Basket's girl friend, have much more limited choices and much more difficult problems finding bikes that fit properly. Go watch the Terry videos to get insight on what the fit problems are and how difficult it is to design around them.

Most small bikes are going to end up with the bars higher than the saddle by default since the size of the head tube is more limited by the amount of steer tube that has to be in the head tube and the wheel size. This may, or may not, be desirable to the rider depending on who they are, how they want to ride and what they plan on doing with the bike. It's the same with "normal" sized riders. Some like their bars higher, some lower and some in between. Small riders often don't have that choice.

Most headtubes aren't going to be anywhere near long enough even on the most comfortable of comfort bikes to allow for replacing 12" of stem sticking out the headset with 12" of head tube. The top tube on most bikes that I've seen...and I've seen a lot of bikes...attaches to the top of the head tube. A 12" long head tube would necessitate a bike that has a much taller standover and would thus be less useful for a small person than even the "normal" tall head tube bikes that they have available.

A 12" long head tube on a small bike would also push the bars way back towards the rider and cramp the rider and make dismounts even more difficult on a bike that probably already has a shallower head tube angle to begin with.

saddlesores

average height of ladies in cambodia is 5'0"

Siu Blue Wind

cyccomute and fixed weasel: I asked for people to stop the nonsense.

Stop.

cyccommute 

I apologize. I have edited my post so as to address only the issues that were raised and removed anything that could be construed as insulting or devisive.

Siu Blue Wind

Thank you.

fixedweasel

Noted my friend.

veganbikes

Word

dim

I bought a touring bike a few years ago .... I spent a long time researching

I ended up with a Surly LHT. What I learned was the following:

If you are going to ride fully loaded (i.e. front and rear panniers), you need to get one size smaller than what you normally get. I'm a 52-53cm and ended up getting a 50cm Surly LHT

I raised the handlebars, added a Giles Berthou Aravis saddle, and the bike fitted like a glove. This is the only road bike that I have ever owned (and I've had a few), where I was comfortable riding in the drops

another thing that I learned, is that Surly strongly advise against getting a kick stand

and .... if you are not sure what size bike may fit you properly, use this site, and use the Eddy bike fit results (for comfort/long distance):

https://www.competitivecyclist.com/S...rBike.jsp#type

that site calculated me as a 53cm .... and Bianchi in Italy also calculated a 53cm size for my measurements

so.... on a normal road bike, I use 52cm or 54cm and play with the stem size/saddle postion

for the touring bike (Surly LHT), I went one size down to a 50cm and it was great

after thousands of miles, I eventually sold the LHT (for a profit), as I wanted a 'fast bike' and used that money for a Giant TCR .... great bike and I rate these highly

but .....

things have moved on now .... welcome 'Gravel Bikes'

they take wide tyres, (mine can fit up to 40mm wide), have mounts for racks and fenders, weigh approx 8-10Kg ... come standard with tubeless ready rims .... and hydraulic disc brakes

plus .... there are new lightweight bikepacking bags (from companies such as Apirura etc)

I'm seeing more and more gravel bikes being used by people who ride long distance Audax rides / Randonneuring rides. The old guys still use their old heavy steel touring bikes though

I have recently bought a Gravel bike and I'm happy... I also use mine for commuting, and will add a new lightweight tubeless ready wheelset with Dynamo lighting

so .... it depends what you want to do .... if you are going to Trek through the Amazon basin, or Sahara dessert, get a Surly LHT or Koga Miyata World Traveller

if you want to ride far distance over a few days, on decent roads, and if you want to get there quick and comfortable, get a gravel bike with good lightweigh wheels and tubeless tyres

there are good gravel bikes such as Specialized Diverge Comp, pinnacle Arkose 4 , Norco Search, etc etc

DropBarFan

I got my Trucker on the largish side, fits great...OTOH in hindsight I would have bought the (2cm) size lower since that would allow using a Thudbuster suspension seat post. Easy enough to compensate for shorter top tube with a longer stem. 559mm/26"-wheel Truckers are basically a gravel bike, no?

Arvadaman

This is how I would go.......

https://www.cycleblaze.com/journals/...lt-her-a-bike/

bikebasket

Been looking at a bike here in the Kingdom of Wonder.

My girlfriend keeps saying it fits her no problem, but the handlebars are 6.5 inches higher than the seat. It's a step through so stand over height ok. Seat just above the frame though.

Any opinions on that 6.5 inch measurement above for touring?