rosefarts

Any mountain bike worth its salt will have a dropper post. That’s not up for debate, it is what it is.

Having a 1x frees up space to add the dropper lever. This is a huge convenience. It’s not why 1x has become standard but it’s one reason it’s not going to go away.

I like my 2x on my road bikes. Works great. Likewise with my mountain and gravel bike 1x. Works great. I wouldn’t switch any of them.

Dan Burkhart 

Correct. Internally geared hubs have over 120 years of history.

CrimsonEclipse

"Are Front Derailleurs Obsolete or Are You Old?

zacster

I meant during the adjustment/calibration, but yes.

zacster

I have a triple on my commuter but I may as well have had a 1x. I never went to the middle ring never mind the small one in all my years of commuting. I don't know offhand what the big ring was but I had a 11-34t cassette. Maybe it was a 46 or 48. Low enough for NYC riding. It is a 1990 era MTB with Shimano Dynasys 10sp parts, a mix of Deore and XT. It all performs well, and going into the largest sprocket was an easier push than shifting to a smaller chainring. Before I retired people would look at the cassette and ask, just how many gears does that thing have? I think of it as a precursor to where we are going today.

slow rollin

I like simple older setups for everything but racing. When i raced xc mtb I ran a 3x initially, then a 2x since the conversion was cheap and it was lighter(fell for marketing hype). In all cases I rode mostly in the 29-32 tooth front chainring and used all of my 11-34 cassette for most ascents when I wasn't bonked/blown up out of my mind. On the 26in bike dropping down to the 22 was perfect for long rides or when I did something stupid and had to ease it home.
On the flipside while riding to trailheads I almost universally appreciated the 3x/big ring (40+tooth).
That's why I like 3x/2x. It's perfect for multi-use. You can use the bike in multiple instances perfectly without buying a new cassette, or a new chainring.

I could do 1x for road since on my local bike trails going much over 20mph is hazardous, and open descents my 225lb mass is plenty fast.
I am half the age or younger then most posters here and can easily use a FD, it's literally a skill issue if you can't, or you are riding in serious mud, in which case maybe electric shifting or singlespeed may be better.

Bill Kapaun

I was just bequeathed this-
Explore E+ 3 (2019) | bike | Giant Bicycles US
You MUST pedal for the assist to work .
You are 100% + 5 levels of assist > 50-100-150-200-250% for a max of 350% of what you put out by yourself.
Limitations are 80 nm (59 ft-lb) and 20 MPH.

One can start off in a MUCH too high of a gear, but it's bound to shorten motor life and chain/cog life. Bogging down an electric motor can't be good??
It's still pretty new to me, having only ridden it about 35 miles.
With 50% assist, it's slightly better than a conventional bike. Probably 40% of that 50% is to compensate for the much heavier bike.
My battery indicator just dropped from 3 to 2 "lights" of 5. I've done some maxing out in testing for the 14-30T cassette I slapped together in place of the 11-36T + racing a few cars across intersections and other childish, new toy stuff.
I could get up to cut off speed with the 14T & smaller (11-13) cogs at which point my severe COPD says COAST! Around town I expect to "commute" about 10-14MPH vs my 6-8 on the regular bike. I can do that w/ 100% assist for most of my riding with maybe a bump up to 150% or a downshift if I start sucking wind too badly.

RCMoeur 

My bikes:
Racer: compact double with close-ratio freewheel. I like it.
Speedy cruiser: 1x9 - 36 front, 11-34 rear. I like it.
Touring cruiser: 3 x 7 - 46/36/26 front, 14-28 rear. I like it.
Commuting cruiser: 40-24 front, 13-28 rear. I like it.
Chrome cruiser: 38 front, Nexus 7 coaster rear. I like it, but I'm not going to set any speed records or climb mountains on it.
Bike Friday: 1x7 - 48 front, 13-32 rear. I like it.
Recumbent: 3x6 - 41-38-24 half-step front, 14-32 rear. I like it, and I coast when I'm going fast enough.
Fixie: 38-18. I like to spin.

I think the point is that in the 21st century there are many different ways to get gears you like. Front derailleurs these days, when properly selected and adjusted, are nearly as effortless as rears. But in some cases you have to know what you like and then make decisions on component selection to get what you like. We've come a long way from when a bike shipped with 52-40 front and 14-18-22-26-32 rear and the shifting sounded like an unhappy semi-truck (even with Suntour derailleurs) and one had to read up on Frank Berto to even realize there were other options.

GamblerGORD53

I last rode a deFaileur 7 years ago. Good riddance. I did have two old timer 1x5 for years. Both worse than a SA 3 speed.
I noticed the first batch of 1x had 28 or 30T fronts. LOL They were going 18 mph in HIGH gear.
I guess they smartened up and put 38 or 40T on the new ones.
The last couple years I'm needing chain cleaning less and less with 2 having a cover. My Rohloff14 chain has been cleaned and lubed once in 3 years/ 4,000+ miles. Just as good for day rides is my SA XL-RD5w, except some hill climbs. Plus I finally got some proper 1/8" chain rings, 2 are steel. Lube stuff once or twice a year. The end of winter rides I wash the sand off wheels/ tires. 1 br apartment still has room for my 3 bikes.
Anybody on the ball now is getting a Pinion for MTB and touring.

Sierra_rider

If I spin out the 34/10 on my XC bike, I'm likely over-biked for the ride anyway and should be on my 2x11 gravel bike anyway. Also my XC bike is a 10-50, once you account for 29" wheels, the 90 rpm speed becomes 27 mph vs the 31 on your triple. The 90 rpm cadence is slightly above 5 mph on the 34/50.

Massive climbing and descending on long rides are not foreign to me...I live and mostly ride in the mountains and my "flat rides" are still 75'/mile. Especially once we get into summer and the snow melts off the higher mountains, it's not uncommon to do 1 hour+ long climbs followed by 30 minute descents. My XC bike isn't purely for racing and my other MTB has never even been raced in its existence, so I think the 1x12 drivetrain is perfectly suitable for recreational riding as well.

I will clarify that my opinion of mtb'ing has changed as the bikes have become more capable. My most current XC bike has 120mm full suspension, dropper post, 180mm discs, etc...basically a waste of its capabilities to just slog on a fire road or paved road IMO. It's still fairly light/fast and a very efficient peddler, but my gravel bike is even faster/lighter for that sort of thing. Maybe a controversial opinion on my part, but that 2x11 gravel bike is just as dirt capable as any of the older XC MTBs. I guess some people may want even lower, but I've been fine with a 31-40 low gear up big "HC" Sierra climbs.

Duragrouch

No. 1X is harder to do on 20" wheels and still have 400% range, and plenty of ground and tire clearance for the rear derailleur. It can be done, with finesse, and more expensive new derailleurs. On larger wheel bikes, 1X is easy, and has no duplicate gears like 2X does. 3X might still be needed for super-lows for heavy touring with big hills.

1X cassettes are also a pain to clean without a shop solvent cleaner. They're riveted together to get sufficient lateral stiffness on the big cogs. Regular cassette, the cogs and spacers come apart for easy cleaning.

rosefarts

With some exceptions on the low end, this hasn’t been true for at least 30 years.

pdlamb

Apparently not in Denmark.

zacster

Definitely not in Denmark. I rode 5 miles with 30 pounds of laundry on my back looking for a laundromat on a typical Danish city bike. It never occurred to me that I might want to shift. On the way back to the AirBnB, I was flying by the commuters. I got some dirty looks because I was probably breaking the local custom of just taking it easy. How do you say "on your left" in Dansk?

Edit: på din venstre side. That is too many syllables to be useful.

veganbikes

Yeah I think they are certainly best at MTB on those fronts.

It depends on the shifters though I have gotten some shifters working and some not from generally all on the STI style front a few triggers but usually those tend to be farther gone but I don't have hard numbers on how many of each so I cannot quantify that in any good way.

Duragrouch

Every 7-speed cassette I've had, came held together with 3 small diameter long bolts, that all broke in about a year (at the juncture of the shoulder and threads, because the shoulder is at full thread diameter instead of minor diameter, so a stress concentration there). Didn't hurt on-bike function in the slightest. The bolts are just for speed of assembly to the freehub body in production.

Jughed

I was all on the 1x train after my first ride on my 1x CX bike. I was all aboard...

My fitness wasn't great, I was a bit heavier than now. The 1x11 did everything, met all of my needs. Easy climbing gears, enough gear for cruising and the occasional higher speed run.

Now I like it for the designed purpose - offroad, gravel, single track. It's nice not to worry about the front mech when knocking around off road.

Now that have better fitness and less mass - a 2x11 on the road with a 1 to 1 option is the best for me. I can climb just about anything, and I have enough top end for higher speed runs.

My 3x9 is fairly useless. Many of the gears overlap and I probably have fewer actual choices and range than the 2x11.

grumpus

I've owned a few triples, all MTB 3x7. The only new bike I've ever bought came with a 32-52 chainset, but no 42t, and since then I've mostly been using what came to be known as a compact double (Suntour called it Microdrive and used an 11t cassette, I don't like those) even on the MTB I built in the eighties. I sacrifice a little top end, but gravity takes me downhill very effectively.

rosefarts

7 speed was pretty popular about 1992, and much lower end. (200gs etc). What part of my statement is wrong?

grumpus

My MTB utility bike, I fitted a road cassette 12-21 so I had plenty of close gears, no need for anything extra low.

Harold74

I'm torn.

I'm currently working on my first 1X conversion. 1x7 with 44T ring/28T cassette. I've never like FD shifting as it feels kind of violent to me relative to RD shifting. I do 90% of my riding alone, on a route close to my home that has only modest, rolling hills. So I expect to be able to get away with this gearing. And I find the prospect of no chain rub and no violent FD shifting very appealing.

On the other hand, I wonder if FD's might make a resurgence as a result of electronic shifting. I don't have much experience with that but, from what I've read, the setup would be more dummy proof and require less maintenance than it does with mechanical shifting.

I do realise that many folks are very good at setting up FD's. Cable tension etc. I do a fair bit of bike work and, still, struggle with it.

1X has an undeniable aesthetic appeal I think. And I'm no exception. Humans seem to share a common impulse towards that which is simple and clean. I wonder if 1X might continue to thrive primarily due to the aesthetic appeal that it has for non-serious cyclists. My brother is an example. He knows very little about road bikes but he knows, with utter conviction, that he wants a single, small chainring.

smd4

Oh, I deny it.

freeranger

I'm not the youngest nor oldest here, but I'll likely be history before a front derailleur is.

Harold74

I will say that, on a road bike, I do not yet enjoy the aesthetic of a dinner plate sized cassette. Or a derailleur cage as long as a child's femur.

For four years now, I've owned at least one bike with 2X half step gearing. I'm embarrassed to report that I didn't understand what that was all about until just last month. Now that I do understand, I find it quite elegant:

- Smaller gear steps.
- Far less "violent" FD shifting than you get with a 16T step.
- Does little for range of course.

After I've had my fun with my 7 speed, 1X 44T/28T setup, I plan to experiment with something like a 2X 44T/40T/28T setup, using that half step chainring gearing concept. Kind of like a sub-compact version of it.

Duragrouch

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duragrouch
(me): 1X cassettes are also a pain to clean without a shop solvent cleaner. They're riveted together to get sufficient lateral stiffness on the big cogs. Regular cassette, the cogs and spacers come apart for easy cleaning.

(you): With some exceptions on the low end, this hasn’t been true for at least 30 years.

Question: What isn't true? Modern 1X cassettes don't come apart. All the old cassettes I've worked with do come apart for cleaning. Yes, they are old or low end. But are you saying that modern, quality, non-1X (road) cassettes are riveted together and do not come apart for cleaning? Maybe the 10/11/12 cogs are so thin they are riveted to an aluminum carrier like much larger 1Xs, for sufficient lateral stiffness? Do tell.