rourkefan

So I have a bit of a mystery - I bought this (tiny, perfect for me!) track frame a couple of years back and I cannot for the life of me work out who might have made it. I live in the UK and the top suggestions so far have been Chas Roberts and Geoffrey Butler, but the way the lugs extend forward on the headtube is something I don't recognise at all. Going to build it up into an all-weather gravel eater while I recover from knee surgery so would nice to know what I'm working on.

Serial number is identical on the frame and forks at least, think that's my best chance as there's zero marking in the dropouts. British threading on the BB, 27.0mm seatpost. Also note the pretty chunky wrap-over seat stays, nothing like the svelte ones on my Rourke. It's pretty lightweight, so the '531 renovated' tubing sticker could be correct (1920g frame, 710g forks) but it's clearly been resprayed at some point making life difficult. Came to me with a campy headset and some Miche-mash BB with a sugino cup mixed in with italian stuff.

Thanks in advance, I've been poring over google images to no avail - time to ask the experts!

machinist42

The Holdsworth Mistral had those head lugs, and wrapover seat stay treatment.


source

The Serial Number and location, and font of at least the "7" is not inconsistent with Holdsworth construction.


source

Here's the place for you to begin.

The letters bracketing the serial elude me at the moment. Do let us know when you suss out their meaning?

rourkefan

Great info! That's the best headtube match I've seen by miles. The letters are what confuse me too! To be continued...

machinist42

If you haven't found it already, here is the definitive table of serial lettering and numbering.

Good Luck!

rourkefan

From diving around the sources on those databases, it seem 'K' denotes a 'stock' frame built for the holdsworth shop? Do you know what that means? Sorry I'm dim. The 67 seems to mean a '67 'shop frame' and the best guess over on Retrobike is that the 'R' means it was made by Charlie Roberts, although who knows. I'll email Geoff and ask.

unworthy1

It certainly ticks some "Holdsworth" boxes with the Prugnat headlugs and wrap-over stays, but as noted the style of stamping in the BB shell looks different than most I've seen (which certainly is not a great number) and the seat lug is not the typical "keyed" ear style of the Mistrals, however a "shop" frame could have custom features (so could the Factory frames for that matter).
I also don't recognize that fork crown.
Do you know who the re-spray shop is (per the sticker, APi maybe)? Maybe if they are still in business they might remember or have records.

Insidious C. 

Here's a Cyclone with that style fork crown.

unworthy1

Per the notes it's an Agrati crown, very interesting!
Not one I'd have expected to find on a Holdsworth but certainly is another box ticked in the evidence column for ID-ing the track frame as a Holdsworth.
Thanks for the info, IC!

clubman 

Is it possible that Argo kept records of their refpainted bikes?

If it fails to be a Holdsworth, you could also try Shorter Rochford bike shop. Alan Shorter made a lot of track frames over the decades, some with similarities.

rourkefan

Clubman - that shorter does look close, thanks! Will investigate. An update on my quest:

K R seems to indicate that this was a frame built (most likely by another builder) to Ken Ryall's specifications. Anyone know much about him? I'm only 30 and been riding classic steel since I was 18 but still learning the big names!

API BIKES were the ones who resprayed the bike - rub by ex-pro Andy Palmer. Unfortunately the email bounces back, and the website looks decidedly early 2000s to be still running (love it).

Still no luck on working out an exact model - I'm guessing it must have been somewhat custom though?