teaksmith

I've got a 1994 Schwinn Voyager with the lugged chro-moly frame, built in Japan. I know this is supposed to be a good frame and probably equal to the newer touring bikes I've been considering: LHT, Kona Sutra, Novara, Salsa, etc. The issue is just compatibility with newer components and systems. I know there are solutions to all of the issues, I'm just wondering if it would be worth it to put a few hundred dollars into getting this bike ready to tour again, vs. buying something off the shelf. Right now I need a new rear wheel because of a broken hub (40-spoke on the rear). Looking at what's out there, I can't find a decent set of touring capable 27-inch wheels unless I go the custom route, I suppose, so I was thinking of switching to 700C (the canti-brakes will adjust down enough). To do that, I'm looking at a minimum of a new wheel set, cassette and chain. The old wheel of course has the 7-speed freewheel. I would then probably upgrade the saddle, handlebars and a few other things, which would start to put the cost close to one of the lower end new bikes. Anyone think this frame is worth it, or have any suggestions regarding a wheelset?

Mr. Jim

You said the hub was broken? Why not just buy a new hub and have your local shop build you a new wheel on the old rim? That would be cheapest. If the rest of your bike is in decent condition, it could just take a tune up and some new brake pads to get you on the road. Folks used to tour with that old drive train, nothing says you can't still as long as it is in good condition. I've got an old fuji Supreme that I have done quite a bit on with the original components.

teaksmith

Thanks for the suggestion. I know that would be the cheapest solution assuming I could find a 40-spoke, 126mm rear hub for a freewheel at a reasonable price. That's been the hard part. So far no luck finding one, though I could find plenty for 36 spokes, which is what the front wheel has.

bradtx

teaksmith, Maybe just me, but the way I see it is that the Schwinn has to be repaired anyway. Might as well incorporate any updated items you see fit to. If you're in the US and going to tour here, then 27" tires aren't a major drawback. With a 700C wheelset you'll be able to use a larger tire if that interests you. If you have 126 mm rear drop out spacing, you can run a 130 mm 8-10 freehub.

Brad

teaksmith

Thanks Brad,

I am in the U.S., but I may take the bike elsewhere too. The rear drop outs will flex enough to fit a 130mm freehub axle. From what I understand, if I do that and add say an 8-speed cassette, I will also need to replace the chain. Is there a particular make or type of cassette and chain that will be compatible with the crankset, rear derailleur and shifters? It currently has all the original Suntour stuff. It came with bar end shifters but I switched to down tube shifters as the frame came with the mounts for them.

shipwreck

Because I like old steel frames like this, I believe that it would be worth it to me to get some 700c wheels in 130mm hubs.
Upgrading the seat and bars is something that many do even with a new bike purchase. The only real reason to get a new bike is if you are wanting one, with all the newer features.

I am planning a couple thousand miles on my 80 something Univega Gran Turismo, and will be replacing a few things like the bearings in my hubs. Still running the Suntour Blueline derailers and suntour bar ends, but have put a new stem and bars on it, along with Areo levers.

Question, what broke on the rear hub?

stevel610 

If you just have to have a new bike, get one. If not, you will have better components if you upgrade the frame you have.

teaksmith

Question, what broke on the rear hub?[/QUOTE]

The outer flange at two spoke holes. It wasn't particularly under stress, I was just cruising along and heard a loud bang. I was still able to ride it some 18 miles to get home (probably thanks to having 40 spokes to begin with).

I did find some 700c wheels with 126mm hubs that will accept my old freewheel. I suppose this would be easier than changing to the cassette. Would it be worthwhile to change to the cassette or just run the freewheel.

I don't really need a new bike. I just bought a new road bike two years ago with all the modern stuff. It's fast and light and fun for training and event rides, but I want to have a touring machine at the ready too. The Voyager fits just fine, but I would like a new stem and handlebars to better replicate the more comfortable position I have on the road bike. And I'll probably put a better seat on it.

teaksmith

I don't have to have a new one. Just trying to do the cost comparisons of buying a new bike with all new, modern components vs. replacing components on what could be a better frame than what I would get on a $1200 to $1500 bike like the ones I'm looking at.

bradtx

teaksmith, To convert to 700C plus changing to 8S+ you'll need a minimum of a wheelset (tires and tubes), a cassette and a chain that matches the cassette. You can use your present shifters in friction mode or optionally replace with indexing shifters. 8S isn't too difficult to friction shift, but 9S and 10S would be touchy for me.

A side note about 40H hubs, I had a Hadley hub break it's flange on my tandem. I won't use a 40H hub unless it's a high flange design.

Brad

saddlesores

i wouldn't necessarily want to rebuild the wheels. you need new hubs, new spokes....but what
about them rims? poor quality, steel or cast iron or what? if you're planning on touring, get
a good wheelset.

teaksmith

The rims are certainly not steel. They are decent Araya aluminum rims and the wheels were strongly built and made for loaded touring. The hub just broke because of metal fatigue I suppose. The Voyager was designed and built for loaded touring and was decent for its day. If it were not, I wouldn't even consider spending money on it. The frame is especially nice, with all the right features and fittings, as well as touring geometry.

I probably will go the new wheelset route though, and since I'm going to be buying wheels, 700c.

teaksmith

Thanks Brad,

That helps as far as calculating the minimum I would need to buy. Seeing how hard it is to find the right 40H hub, I will probably avoid them as well. It looks like all the new bikes I've been looking at come with 36H wheels front and rear.

LDB

+1 for the Voyager also but I like the older bikes and reviving anything possible for that matter.

rodar y rodar

Plenty of options, your choice....

The cost of refurbishing your Voyageur will vary considerably depending on exactly what you want to do to it, how you source the parts (used, watch for closeouts, buy right now), and how much you do yourself versus paying a shop mechanic to do. The price of a replacement bike is also going to vary a lot, obviously. All in all, you`re looking at the same ballpark range, so it comes down to whether or not you want to keep the Schwinn. It sounds to me like you do, but maybe I`m misreading.

I agree that 36h hubs and rims give you a lot more availability and better prices. If you`re really hard on wheels, maybe you should stay with 40h, but I wouldn`t do that on my own bikes. Like you said, most new (touring) bikes come with 36. Getting away from touring, heck- half of them only have a handful of spokes these days! A whole new wheel will probably be cheaper than replacing a hub unless you lace it yourself, and even then you`ll probably need to buy new spokes unless you can match the old hub`s dimentions fairly well. If you get a new wheel or new freehub, remember that you aren`t obligated to move up to 8,9, or 10 speed. with just a few exceptions, you can put a 7 speed cassete with a little shim on the same hub that accepts any of those others. If you do want to stick with 27 inch rims for some odd reason, you can still do that too. Sun CR-18 is easy to find, inexpensive, and should do the trick for you.

Somebody already mentioned that you can use your current shifters in friction mode. Just make sure that you actually have that mode- I`m pretty sure all Shimano DT shifters did, but not so sure about Suntour. 7 speed chains are the same as 8 speed chains (also the same as 5 speed and 6 speed chains). Last thing, 7 and 8 speed cassettes and chains are pretty cheap, and they`re consumeables anyway, so if you end up buying a new one, don`t sweat it.

If you go with friction shifters, pretty much anything works. For index, you need to match shifters with derailler and cassette. In that case, Shimano shifters and deraillers are the simplest sure-fire way, with any compatible (Sram, Shimano, or generic) chain and cassette for the same number of "speeds" as the shifters. It might sound complicated, but it really isn`t too bad.

EDIT: I see you`re looking at brand new bikes. In that case, the Voyageur will be cheaper. For a patient Craigslist watcher, probably cheaper to replace.

teaksmith

Thanks for the detailed reply and explanation of the various options. Regarding the Sun CR-18 rims, I did find a 700c wheelset using these rims and a 126mm freewheel hub - offered by Harris. This option would allow me to simply remove the freewheel from the old rear wheel and re-use it on the new one, and the only other change would be adjusting the brakes. They offer this wheel with a 27-inch CR-18 rim too, but I like the idea of more tire selection with the 700c. The only question would be the strength of this wheel and the quality of the hubs (Quando). I've read mixed reviews on that. It seems the rims are fine but maybe the hubs questionable?
They are 36h, though, and sealed bearings.

I think the Suntour shifters will work in friction mode. They came on the bike as bar ends, but when I bought it new in '94 I had them move the shifters to the downtube mounts. The front has always been friction but the rear is indexed.

I was apparently wrong about the model year of this bike. After doing some research I learned that it has to be either a '90 or '91, as those were the last two years for the Voyageur and it is the charcoal gray color they came in those years. It was still new at my local LBS in '94, but then, touring bikes never have been popular around here, which makes the Craigslist find less likely too.

Even if I buy a new bike, I will probably go ahead and get the Voyageur back on the road first. I miss riding it on the rough roads around here and for almost two years have been riding my Trek 2.3 exclusively.

rodar y rodar

They also offer it with a Shimano freehub for $10 less. Undecided?
https://sheldonbrown.com/k7.html

Glad to hear you want to keep the Voyageur even if you get an additional bike. As long as you have room for it, the more the merrier!

I`m a semi Schwinn fan, and thought that the original Schwinn company disappeared after the 92 model year (as opposed to the companies who have since owned rights to the name), but wasn`t positive. "91 or 92" makes more sense to me. You might be able to nail it down by color and components if you find a match for it here:
https://bikecatalogs.org/SCHWINN/years_by_model.html

Barcons moved to the downtube? I didn`t know that could be done. Not sure all ST barcons worked the same, but on a pair that I once had, there were little marks on the plastic ring around the base to indicate friction or index mode. Loosen the center screw a little bit and rotate the plastic ring to the other position, tighten screw. Shimano works in a similar way, but not necessary to loosen the screw first. It`s worth mentioning that those ST shifters eventually blew up on me, so I replaced them with Shimano (ST worked fine, but not so easy to find these days) and I expected i`d have to use friction mode. For some reason, the Shimanos indexed properly with my ST derailler and freewheel even though technically that isn`t supposed to work. So, if you start changing drivetrain parts around, go ahead and try the indexing- you might get lucky too.

teaksmith

Thanks for that Schwinn catalog link. It is for sure the 1991 Voyageur. The color, decals and specs are an exact match to the Voyageur on the top left of this page, charcoal gray with red decals. It was apparently the last model of Schwinn Voyageur made:

https://bikecatalogs.org/SCHWINN/1990...Duo_Sport.html

I don't know if they somehow moved the barcons or just used the original shifter levers on different downtube mount shifters. All I know is the levers are Suntour and are color-matched to the frame.

The link to Sheldon Brown's page on different Shimano hubs and cassettes is very helpful.

badger_biker 

I have a 1987 Voyageur and find that it is a great all around bike and handles a load like a champ. I'd encourage you to fix yours up. I have no problem touring on the 27" wheels and actually find the extra size a benefit in ride smoothness. That being said, if you intend to ride where you need tires wider than 1 1/4" you may want to consider going to 700c if you wind up replacing the wheels.

The old Voyageurs had nearly every touring bell and whistle and you'll pay plenty for that in a new bike.

teaksmith

I will now have more time to research the component options while fixing this up. Instead of rushing to get it back in rideable condition, I am in less of a hurry now, as I picked up a very lightly used 2012 Surly LHT at a great price last Friday. This will give me a touring bike to ride in the meantime, and I'll probably set the Surly up with beefier tires and other stuff for more rough roads and gravel kind of stuff, and keep the Voyageur pretty much stock. I can already tell the Surly feels more sluggish unladen than the Voyageur, but it is a smooth ride and it's nice to have all brand new stuff on it.

rodar y rodar

Perfect!