jorglueke

Aside from weight is there an advantage to the upruight bike in applying power straight down for hills?

What's to steep a grade for a recumbent with a decently fit rider?

VegasTriker

The limiting factor for friends of mine who ride the two wheeled recumbents is the "stall speed" which is the speed at which the bike becomes unstable and you are no longer able to steer it reliably. For my friend who rides an HPV streetmachine that is roughly 4.5 mph. I had to stop my trike on a trail where it was washed out and he dumped his bike when he slowed too much but wasn't able to either stop or go around the obstruction. That's also what I experienced when I was still riding two wheeled recumbents both short and long wheelbase.

I haven't found a hill I couldn't climb without stopping while on my trike. If you are reasonably fit and have a decent gear range you just climb slowly. A fit DF rider is still likely to have trouble climbing hills on a recumbent at first since you are using different muscle groups.

Retro Grouch 

My son and I were riding a tandem on an organized ride that included a very steep hill on a brick paved street. We only saw one DF single bike who could make it up the hill. Many of the riders were strong enough but, at some point, a bump would cause them to pop a wheelie and then they were done. Our tandem, of course, didn't have that problem and I suspect that, with practice, many more of the folks with whom we were riding would have been able to complete the climb too.

I'm thinking "piece of cake" for my tadpole recumbent trike. No stall speed issue and no insufficient front wheel loading problem.

iambent

Was the hill in Alton, IL?

jorglueke

I don't climb anything extreme, maybe 10% grade for a minute is probably the max.

BlazingPedals

Standing up on an upright lets you balance at a lower speed, but it also recruits more muscles. So uprights have an advantage in my book. On my bents I've been up a couple of hills at or slightly above 20% grade for a short distance, with significant distance above 12-15%. I imagine a trike with low gears could make it up almost any road, albeit at a crawling speed.

Retro Grouch 

Nope, just outside of Giant City Park near Carbondale IL. I don't remember the name of the little hamlet.

iambent

Sounds like the wall hill at Makanda.

Weselfs

I don't know about too steep. We trained for this year's World Senior Olympics uphill race (Huntsman World Senior Games) and the Tour of the Moon ride (ICON EYECARE TOUR OF THE MOON | Grand Cycling Classic - October 1, 2016) on a hill near our Colorado home that finishes at 11%. (At just over 6,000 feet of elevation)

I can say that 11% feels steep, but it is not impossible.

That training hill's steepness served us well at the Games, because we (DH & I) turned in far faster times on the race course than we did on our training one.

The 62-mile Tour route included 3,700 feet of vertical climb, and that only started to feel like a lot at the top. We finished the Tour before the bottom third of upright riders.

Our trikes are Catrike Expeditions. We're 55 and 57 years old and have had our trikes less than a year. (3,000 miles and 10 months to be exact) FWIW and all.

JanMM

Rode my LWB V3 on the first day of the Hilly Hundred this past weekend and made it up all the hills - the biggest challenge was a short hill with max grade of 18%. Not sure what my slowest speed was on that hill - too busy trying not to oversteer but steer just enough to keep straight - no time to look at the Garmin. Did I mention the V3 is a bit twitchy at slow speeds? The other hills that day were no problem - all were less than 14% max.
My stoker helped me get up all the hills but one on the second day. Mt. Tabor is 23% max - we haven't made it up that one on the Screamer but did get up it a couple of times on our previous KHS Tandemania a few years ago. We find the Screamer to be slow but very steady uphill. Tracks straight ahead in the 2-3 mph range if needed. The V3, on the other hand, begins to feel funny around 6 mph on a climb. Have ridden the V3 a lot more this year since swapping out the steel frame for a titanium one and find that the more I ride it, the better it feels climbing. Great power transfer but have to remember to keep a light touch on the bars and steer only as needed.

toolbear

On a bike you fall over if you go too slow. On a trike you remain seated.

It helps to have some gears down around 8-10 gear inches for steep hills. That will allow you to remain seated while pedaling up the hill.

It also helps to have a Humble Attitude, which is what I had while climbing Gatehouse Pass. On the right I was passed by a guy who was reading the paper and smoking a cigarette as he climbed the hill. However, once on top, I blasted down the far side for some happy miles.

I opted for the SRAM Dual Drive option on my Scorpion. That means 27 gear combinations and the option of going 25% above or below a given combination for 81 possible combinations. Even with that I had to grind over a moon bridge (half cylinder) that I hit at low speed.

sch

Upright bikes have three advantages for hills and acceleration (which are almost the same thing, differing in speed,
ie for hills you are under 10-12 mph and for sprints over 25mph) The lightest bents are still north of 20#, usually
closer to 30# when equipped with water, snacks and a few tools/tubes. Similarly priced uprights will be 16-18#.
Only a vanishingly few bents allow any upper body input into hill climbing or sprinting and this is only a few percent
of the upper body contribution on
uprights. To compare try an 8-10% hill climb on an upright with just your finger tips on the bars and then again
with your usual grip, note the difference hey? Finally uprights always have the option of standing up, which
clearly magnifies the accel capability. Some bent riders can stay with uprights on some hills but most of us
will climb 3-6 mph faster on any upright compared to a high end bent (under 25#).

fietsbob

You can Gear Super Low and , with a trike, not worry about falling over ..

BlazingPedals

When upright riders ask about hill climbing, they're not so worried about making it to the top as they are about falling off the back of the group by the time they're at the top. Using those criteria, gearing down and climbing a 10% grade at 2 mph while the rest of the group scampers up at 8 mph would earn the trike rider an "F" in hill climbing.

Weselfs

DH and I were finishing the 5K practice hill climb (the one with an 11% 1/4 mile finish) at moving averages of 5.6 and 4.6, mine being the slowest of the two.

Agreed: humility is warranted when climbing hills on trikes.

We do have 2 elliptical chain rings, but our granny gear is the factory issue 30 tooth gear, so nothing special really.

edgross208

I am a physician with a history of bad knees and an avid cyclist for many years so I think I qualify to offer some comments on the questions raised in this thread. I'm actually a pediatrician but I am current on rehab medicine. From 1963 to 1998 I commuted by bike through the Boston slush and rain just about every day. Aside from the frozen parts, I was pain-free, perhaps numb. About 40 years ago I was swept up in the running craze and trained for marathons and then began the decline of my joint health. I started riding a recumbent (Vision 65 with 24 inch wheels front and rear) because it was more comfortable than my DD bikes, especially for my neck which like the vast majority of human necks, was increasingly affected by osteoarthritis, which made it difficult to extend for adequate forward vision through my glasses (rather than peering over their tops). My knees were recumbent-neutral but my head and neck rejoiced.

About 10 years ago I found myself unable to run because of knee pain and walking became increasingly difficult. Imaging demonstrated classic "bone on bone" advanced osteoarthritis so I now am the owner of two knee replacements. I have participated in a variety of medium length rides on the knees without much more than mild discomfort.

I think that the biomechanics of recumbent bikes tend to off-load the knees and should be less wearing on osteoarthritic joints. The more horizontal the leg position, the less the knees have to prop the rest of the body against gravity. The neck also gains from the upper back support of the usual 'bent comfy seat. It is quite clear that spinning is preferable to crunching but it isn't always possible, especially with a swb bike like mine. The strong mesh seat allows using one's back as a fixed point for some crunching and the effort that results is beneficial for common back pain.

Balance also commonly declines with age and the many positive comments about trikes are worth taking seriously. My wife at 69 years old no longer trusts her balance and can find a way to get on the road using a trike.

JanMM

Good post. Good points.
I would suggest that many forget or aren't aware that engaging in activities that require balancing, like bicycling, can help maintain one's balance skills. A trike isn't the inevitable final cycling destination for all cyclists. Which isn't to say that folks shouldn't ride trikes as needed or as desired.

Weselfs

To show what is possible on a 2-wheeled recumbent: crazyguyonabike.com: Bicycle Touring: California Cycling Adventure--Yosemite--2011, by Phil Knoll

This was in 2011. I was honored to meet these two wonderful gentlemen at the 2016 Huntsman World Senior Games held in St George, Utah. Terry was injured and did not race, however Phil won gold in his division in the 5K hill climb and 20K time trial.

The Huntsman World Senior Games are the only games that qualify medalists for the US Senior Olympics that has a division for both 2 and 3 wheeled recumbents, by the way.* These divisions are separate from one another and separate from upright bikes. Bottom line: there were 80 golds, 80 silver and 80 bronze medals available for recumbent racers however only 12 golds were awarded. That's because there were only 6 racers in 6 different divisions, each racing unopposed in two events, and each one winning gold. So, if you want to test your skill, may I suggest looking into the HWSG 2017? Check it out here: Huntsman World Senior Games

* Not that at this time it does one much good, as the US Senior Olympics themselves do not have recumbent divisions. One day, though.