RMTBaiden

Eric F reply to me about the orange reply will help you out on this question. It's basically just an add on to my original question so not rude, but I would have started that the same way haha.

PeteHski

Length of ride and how hard you are riding are the main things to consider.

For long, hard rides (4+ hours) I usually aim to consume 50-80g of carbs per hour in various formats. I usually start off with energy bars and 2 bottles of energy mix drink. Then I gradually move to gels and refresh my bottles as required. The longer into a hard ride, the less I feel like eating solid food on the bike. I don’t bother with any protein until after the ride is finished.

If I’m riding slower or shorter then I eat a lot less and just drink water or maybe 1 bottle of energy mix and 1 bottle of water.

MoAlpha

I am saving the remains of a box of cherry caffeine ones for true ordeals.

Eric F 

I have a long gravel race on Sunday, and I'll be armed with 6 of my precious Clif Shots. It pains me to hit my last box that hard.

big john

In my case I would be more selective on longer rides. If I'm doing something shorter or easier I can eat just about anything and even eat too much of it. On a longer ride with lots of climbing I have to be more careful.
I usually eat regular food like bananas, sandwiches, and certain baked goods instead of space food. I've tried lots of products made for fueling and some work fine, however. Can't stand gels and some of the powdered mixes upset my stomach.

Sierra_rider

I know that ride well, nutritional demands will be high on a ride like that. If you already haven't done so, incorporate whatever food you plan on eating, into your current training plan. Carb requirements will be very high (unless you are gifted with some insanely good power:weight ratio,) so work on being able to consume a bunch of carbs during the ride. What that looks like, as far as grams, is variable to the individual...the amounts that PeteHski mentioned are good starting points. The carbs need to be quick/easy to process and be readily available for usage.

I've tried various gels and drink mixes...I'm pretty much a fan of the SIS gels in an event like the Death Ride. I'll occasionally have a Honey Stinger waffle, but that's partly as a morale booster for something different. There is a lunch stop at the 1/2 point of the ride, but the last thing I want is to be trying to digest harder-to-breakdown foods when I still have 7k' of climbing to go. I usually don't ride with an electrolyte mix in my bottles, but I'll have 1 of my bottles with mix for something like the Death Ride. I carry extra SIS tablets to add as I top off that bottle with more water. My other bottle, I always keep just straight water in.

Sierra_rider

A bit of a tangent, and I always get someone who thinks I should fuel off of kale smoothies and broccoli florets, but my recent fueling strategy for the 70 mile/8300' climbing XC MTB race at Sea Otter(5ish hours time for me): I aimed for 3 SIS gels an hour, which is not an exact science, as the course terrain often dictates where I can mess with squeezing out a gel. The feed zone at the 1/2 point, I loaded up on more gels and shotgunned a can of coke. I had a small hydration pack of straight water and a bottle with SIS tablets that I swapped at the feed zone as well. I ate quite well in the days leading up to the event and I never had a hint of "cracking" that I often get in longer races.


I use the "cherry" flavored SIS gels, they're one of the few gels that I actually like the taste of and don't find at least mildly disgusting.

Carbonfiberboy 

Yes, fig bars, and in particular, Fig Newmans. Way better. Above, pdlamb suggested Snickers, and I second that. The wonderful thing about Snickers is that one can find them everywhere, including abroad.

Eric F 

Awesome that you did the XL at Sea Otter! A cold Coke in the last half of a long race/event is always a nice boost. At a gravel race in February, I said "I love you right now" to the nice lady handing out Cokes, and I meant it.

For fueling, I've found that the constant drip of fuel from a high-carb mix in my bottles is really helpful for staying ahead of need. As you said, the terrain doesn't always allow for a gel. The chance to swig from a bottle tends to be more available.


Cherry might be okay for me. I tend to prefer citrus, and dislike chocolate or espresso. I also like my gels caffeinated. I need to try a few things to see what is going to work for me when the time comes to make a switch.

genejockey 

But it's what plants crave!


EDIT: I agree that electrolytes on the bike are pointless, unless you lick them off to replenish your sodium.

PeteHski

Yep, 3 gels per hour is about my going rate for a hard ride, alongside a bottle of carb mix. I go easy on the broccoli florets 😂

It is practically impossible to over-fuel if you are riding hard. But you can certainly eat the wrong things or under-fuel. I’ve learned to keep well away from “party” food at feed zones. Although I might chomp a few Jaffa cakes if I see them.

Eric F 

During long events/races, I find my body craving for something more substantial than gels and carb-loaded drinks around lunchtime. A protein bar has worked well for me to satisfy that craving. These aren't events where a sandwich/pizza stop is realistic. If not a protein bar, what else might be a good choice in a fairly compact format?

I've been paying attention to your comments (along with other sources echoing the same thing) over the years about the uselessness of electrolyte drinks during exercise, which is part of the reason I opt for a high-carb mix, instead.

MoAlpha

The ‘lytes on my bike come from my skin, so it’s just recycling when I lick off the top tube at the end of a ride. (Yum) Incidentally, sweat contains a little higher proportion of K than plasma, for reasons intrinsic to sweat gland physiology, and Pepsi is said to have more K than Coke. I used to think about that kind of nonsense back in the dark ages.

genejockey 

Is that why it tastes like ****?

BTW, there was an interesting video on GCN, about how different people excrete differing amounts of salt in their sweat, and how Dan happens to be one of those who doesn't excrete as much, but when he was racing he didn't know that, so during one of the big Tours he was eating the diet the team provided which was loaded with salt, so he ended up GAINING weight over the Tour instead of losing it. All water, of course.

genejockey 

I've taken to drinking just water on any ride shorter than 3 hours, and even then I only use a drink mix when it's short sleeve jersey weather.

MoAlpha

Yeah, hunger isn’t all about energy metabolism and on those long events you gotta do what gets you through it. Chapeau! There’s nothing intrinsically wrong with protein bars and I eat an embarrassing number of them at work, because I’m too lazy to make lunch and too cheap to buy it. I just don’t eat or crave them on the bike. I like the Gatorade brand ones.

Back in the day, I rode with old Cat 1s who carried boiled eggs and raw ground beef on rides.

Eric F 

I've found that high-carb drink mix is beneficial for me on any ride over 2 hours. I don't use "hydration" mixes.

MoAlpha

K salts do taste horrible. I think there’s a lot of that in bowel prep.

Yes, huge variation in sweat rates and Na content, but the Na replacement issue is really the large intake of hypo-osmotic fluid in the heat and the risk of hyponatremia, rather than the absolute losses per se.

genejockey 

I don't really like drinking carbs enough for the last half of a 4 hour ride. Instead, I like to stop at about the halfway point on Sunday rides and just eat something. The black cherry chews with caffeine are good - I'm eating Skratch's now but Clifs are at least as good and easier to get out of the package.

Eric F 

Go with whatever works for you. I might have to check out the Clif chews. I like the Skratch ones, but agree that the packaging leaves a little to be desired.

genejockey 

Words to live by.

The Clif ones, I just tear the end off and squeeze them out 2 at a time. I have seen people stick them to the top tube, and I guess that's one way to try and recover some of the salt from your sweat...

Sierra_rider

Yep, the XL...fun race, but very competitive. Just going off average speed, I would've been podium material for my class, in last year's event. This year was completely stacked and a podium ended up being out of the question, as was the Leadville invite I was hoping for. I'm still pumped on how I rode, I set a PR for 3.5-5 hour power numbers...which is not something I'd ever expect to do on a MTB. For me, hilly MTB rides are almost always considerably less average power than a road or gravel ride of comparable perceived effort...probably because of coasting, soft pedaling, letting off the power to navigate trail features, etc.

The coke wasn't even a huge moral booster, as I pulled it out of my feed bag that was warm. A spectator offered me ice, but I was in full race mode, so I declined and proceeded to shotgun the whole thing in about 10 seconds lol. I was slower on my 2nd lap, but I consider my fueling and pacing strategy a success, as I was much more of the passer than the passee. Besides, the way that the start order was lined out in each wave, meant that I had no chance to be at the front of the field going into the first singletrack.

The terrain issues are partly why I've gone to a hydro pack in most XC events. In the short local XC races, I'm usually the lone nerd in my class that's running a hydro pack...it looks totally Freddly, but I can grab water at almost any point of a course and do it without letting off the gas.

Sierra_rider

I was being a bit facetious, but I did get lectured on here before for my ride nutrition. I guess it was unacceptable to use simple carbs to fuel my way through a 5000 calorie ride. For a certain individual, they couldn't understand how my normal diet and my ride nutrition could be 2 separate things.

Anyway, I totally agree about how it's almost impossible to overeat during a hard ride. The caveat I'll give to that, is if someone hasn't trained themselves to eat that much during a hard effort. My nutrition strategy definitely changes with the event. If it's a non-racing event, or the race is broken down into timed stages, I'll definitely peruse the feed stops. I might not be as regular with my gels, but I'm still getting the calories in. If it's a long race that's timed from start to finish, I typically forgo the feed zones(except to chug a coke) and stick to the gels I have on me. With my recent MTB race, I could set up my own feed at the start of lap 2, so I just went that route instead of carrying a dozen gels on me...I was in and out of that feed zone in less than a minute.

PeteHski

I’m the same with event feed zones. I often skip them completely or just use them to refill bottles. On the L’Etape du Tour we had a private feed station where I could store my own bag. But I will often set off on a century event with a dozen gels, half a dozen bars and 2x 1L bottles of carb drink. I can often get through non-stop on that gear, but might need to stop for a bottle refill if it’s hot or 5+ hours.

Eating “healthy” food on a hard bike ride is not very effective or practical. Simple, easily digestible carbs are king. For those in the UK (as I don’t think they export) I find Veloforte a good brand for more natural ride fuelling. Their gels and bars are pretty tasty.