Eyes Roll

Hello Gurus, I have a 2020 Single Speed/Fixed Gear bike with a flip flop hub. Right now, I am using it as a Fixed Gear bike.

The Freewheel Cog on the non-drive side is rubbing against the frame when riding the bike, as you can see in the videos below. How do I stop the rear cog from rubbing the frame and eliminate the rubbing noise? Add spacers? Add washers? Or file down the frame itself?

Your input and advice is appreciated. Thank you in advance for your time and help. 🙏

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KlR...usp=drive_link

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iBV...usp=drive_link

JohnDThompson 

A spacer will increase the clearance, but may make it harder to get the wheel in and out of the frame. If there's plenty of clearance on the fixed side, you could shift the whole axle set over by moving a spacer from the fixed side to the freewheel side, and then re-dish the wheel. It looks like your wheel could use a little truing touch-up, anyway.

Quick 'n' easy fix, if you're not using the freewheel, is just remove it from the hub.

bwilli88 

Just add a couple of washers on that side until it stops, probably 2mm or so.

Eyes Roll

I should have added that the rubbing started after I removed the axle, re-greased and re-packed the ball bearings, adjusted the cones, and put everything back in the order I removed it, about 6 months ago. I did not ride this bike since the day the rubbing started, and the bike has been lying in my garage ever since. The rubbing and the rubbing noise did not exist before. Now I could not figure out where I made a mistake, after several tries to remove the axle, re-adjust the cones, put the parts back again. I re-greased and re-packed the ball bearings for my other 1990s vintage geared bike without an issue, and now the vintage bike rides very smooth.

Thank you 🙏. There's a lot of clearance on the drive-side. This bike is the most simple bike I have ever seen. I do not think there were spacers and washers on either side, when I worked on the bike, 6 months ago, but I will remove everything and check again. I recall there's the axle, cones, and lock nuts on either side. That's it.

When I bought the bike, it came with the Single Speed freewheel as the drive-side, and I could coast with the Single Speed freewheel. On one of my rides in the year 2022 when I was riding the bike as a Single Speed, I suddenly heard a grinding noise in the rear hub and the bike couldn't spin the wheel at all on the street. I flipped the hub to Fixed Gear right away and got home. I have been riding this bike as a Fixie ever since. Having said that I like coasting since it gives me breathing time and allows me to relax whenever I need to without continuous movement of legs and continuous pedaling.

I have purchased a new Single Speed freewheel and will install it when I find time. I would like to have additional option of riding the bike as a Single Speed, since I like to coast.


Thank you 🙏. Do appropriate-size washers from the hardware store work?

Andrew R Stewart 

Sounds like on reassembly the axle spacers were not replaced in the OEM order or position. This should be a simple fix, revisit the assembly as already mentioned.

As to the FW's becoming grindy and loosing ratchet engagement the usual cause is grit/grime/rust preventing the tiny ratchet pawls from freely moving back and forth. If this bike saw wet weather and/or winter use after a couple of years (2020 to 2022) this exposure could be enough to cause this problem.

No location info offered so I can't say if road salt (winter riding) or sea salt (puddles on boardwalks/beach front trails) contributed. If so then it would quicken up the rusting of the freewheel's internals.

Most bike bits are made with the bike needs as the goal. Most hardware store washers don't have the OD, ID and thickness that bike specific ones have. If used as axle spacers a too big around (the OD) washer might rub on the inside of the freewheel, although most single speed freewheels have a large enough ID to clear big spacer washers. Multi speed freewheels often don't have that clearance space. Andy

Eyes Roll

I reassembled every part in the order I removed them. I did not lose any parts in the process.

Do you think the guys at the LBS lost spacer(s) or washer(s) when the bike was taken to them for servicing? If that was the case, how do I know what parts are lost? And what is the OEM order of assembling parts? I do not know anyone who owns the same make and model of bike to go and check.

Andrew R Stewart 

The problem I have with a shop now in the mix and possibly being blamed for a missing part that makes the bike not ride "properly" is that this means the shop likely didn't reinstall the wheel or test ride it or the bike after to confirm the servicing went well. But we still don't even know what that shop really did. But since they are not here to give their side I'll also consider blaming that shop Andy (hoping readers see my satire)

grumpus

First off, check the bike's specification to see if it's supposed to be 110 or 120 mm across the dropouts, and measure yours. Correct the spacing as necessary, including frame alignment check. Now check the hub is a good fit in the frame, adjust as necessary by adding or removing spacers. The distance from the hub bearing/dust cover to the locknut on each side should be the same - correct by moving spacers/washers from one side to the other. If you still have a clearance problem move washers from fixed side to freewheel side, or get a narrower freewheel. Check/correct wheel dish.
​​​​​​Or you could just add a couple of washers and see how it goes.

79pmooney

EyesRoll, have you measured the dropout inside width and the locknut to locknut width on the hub? For a traditional fix gear or one speed, that should be 120mm on the hub and just over on the dropouts. Knowing this will tell you more about where to go next. If your hub has a shorter width than the dropout spacing, probably a spacer got lost along the way. Any bike shop could sell you one. They'll have a drawer of them in various sizes. JohnD recommends against but I've used hardware washers a few times. I try to seek out washers that look cut and flat, not stamped with a rounded top and place them inside the locknut and as far from the cone as I can.

Also, juggling washers to more on the freewheel side might do just the trick. Perhaps assemble the axle with just cone, lockwasher and locknut on each side then toss washers on each side to find the combo that gets clearance on both sides, the best alignment you can get with the chainring and ease of removing and replacing the wheel. If you have to choose between best alignment for the freewheel or fix gear, favor the fix gear. That's where chains throw and where throwing chains is less fun. (Yes, the loose washers will make replacement artificially hard but once you have the combo that works, you remove the locknuts and tuck those washers/spacers inside and reassemble.)

Back to the dropout/lockwasher spacing. (OLD -over locknut dimension) Yes, the old 120mm was the standard forever but starting in the '70s, 126mm started happening, then 130 with 8-speed and beyond and now more big ones. And, the bikes themselves change as people "stretch" the dropouts to fit more gears. Things like bike bending crashes happen. There are thousands of frames out there that are at none of the standards. For more info, go to Sheldon Brown's site - https://sheldonbrown.com/frame-spacing.html. What matters for you is that the hub and dropouts match and do what you want and that is line up your cogs properly and clear of the frame. But knowing the OLD will also tell you what hubs out there will work and more about the bike you have.

I haven't spent much time on single speed freewheels since I took my 5-speed FW that I had been riding single speed on the middle cog 47 years ago, tossed in a fix gear wheel and took a spin. Sold! Never rode single speed again. One of my bikes has always been a workhorse fix gear with the used frame I found after I crashed and killed its predecessor. Some good solid bikes, easy to work on and sweet rides, some less so. Been making those fix gears work a long time. Been in(almost) your shoes a few times. Enjoy the process of getting this to work, then go out and enjoy the ride! (And for on-the-road wheel flips, get the Pedros Trixie fix gear tool. A good wrench for the hub nuts, an excellent spanner for removing fix gear lockrings; best I've used and the spanner is very useful for picking up and holding the chain and keeping your hands clean. No, I do not get a commission from Pedros! But I do buy and strap on that tool to every fix gear tool bag with Velcro for very fast wheel flips.)

JohnDThompson 

Perhaps the axle was reversed when re-installed (i.e. what was the freewheel end of the axle is now the fixed end)? Or all the hardware was removed from the axle when serviced, instead of just one side? Removing everything from the axle makes it trickier to get the offsets right when reinstalling. Removing only one side's cone, washer(s) and locknut, and remembering which end (fixed or freewheel) it came from, means reinstallation uses the same offsets as before service.

Iride01 

I always believe I did everything correctly and reassembled things exactly as they were before. However I've been proven wrong on more than one occasion.

DiabloScott

Can't you just flip flop your wheel and see if the fixed cog does the same thing?
1. If it does, the issue is NOT with your axle and spacers.
2. If it doesn't, it might be.
3. If your wheel is out of center when you flip flop, it certainly is.

veganbikes

I wouldn't think the LBS had anything to do with anything in this situation. They seem pretty irrelevent in this whole ordeal as they weren't mentioned till the last post and not in a way that would involve them. It is likely that when doing your servicing maybe something went on incorrectly which happens to all of us including some seasoned mechanics.

To figure out what the order of parts is you would need a diagram of the hub one of those blow out images like Shimano and others have but for your specific hub and for that you would need to know what hub it was and who made it and then reach out to that company and see if they can help otherwise I would take it to the shop and have them take a look. Generally if the shop isn't taking apart your hub as part of service you requested or because it was needed they aren't going to lose parts there because there is nothing there to lose that would have this effect unless something was done incorrectly the first time around or it is some unique situation.

wheelreason

Yes, yes, the shop did that..... NOT!

oldbobcat

That's the freewheel rubbing against the dropout. Since you're not using it, the quickest solution is to remove it.

It does look like your rim is is not centered, favoring the non-drive side between the chain stays, so it's likely you did not reassemble the axle spacers in the right order.

mrrabbit 

I've posted this many times in the past:

https://www.mrrabbit.net/docs/freewhe...OLD_sizing.pdf

Assuming it's a 120mm rear hub . . .

. . . measure dimension A . . . should be at least 25mm on both sides?

=8-|

FBinNY 

Pardon if it's been said (I haven't read every post).

There's a big clue in the sequence of events which should lead to a solution. You say it was fine until you serviced the hub. Obviously, you changed something. Assuming all the same parts, you must have put them together differently. Possibly moved a spacer from one side to the other, possibly left a spacer on the floor (under the furniture), or possible either the 2 cones or locknuts aren't identical, and you switched sides.

Start by measuring the over locknut axle width, or by fitting the wheel in the frame and noting any gap between frame and hub. Then take apart, and switch things around, or simply adding another washer under the locknut on the freewheel side.

BTW- in your video, I noted more than typical freewheel wobble. It's possible that a better truer running freewheel will solve the problem.

Eyes Roll

I have removed everything and centered the axle putting everything back, leaving the same length of axle (in mm) sticking out on either side, and the rubbing and rubbing noise is gone for now. None of the parts are missing.

Thank you all 🙏 for your time and insights.