9 Speed Friction. Finicky…
09-06-23, 11:58 AM
#26
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Starting with jamesdak's post, several mentions by now of how cabling can be an issue, most especially with such long runs of cable!
Any friction in the system at all, as with a well-used rear-most cable housing segment, or with the cable running against the bare steel of a bottom bracket cable guide, causes the length of the long cable to change whenever the lever is moved (caused by the cable movement having to overcome static-friction force).
The most notorious cases of cable friction/elasticity occurred when stainless cables were used in the unlined coiled-stainless cable housings, but friction/elasticity problems can occur anywhere along the cable's path (though have their worst effect further from the shift lever).
Choice of cable lubricant can also be a factor, as cable-specific greases made from silicone and Teflon (as opposed to hydrocarbon) tend to give lowest friction along the cable's polymer-lined path from shifter to derailer. SRAM and Shimano both offer such (seemingly expensive) cable greases, but just a very light application along the cable wire is all that is needed for super-slick operation.
Try making slight movements of the shift lever, taking note of any tendency of the derailer not actually moving in response to these back-and-forth movements. This would be a definite indication of cable friction and elasticity causing the shifting to be unresponsive and/or feeling imprecise.
Lastly, any use of abrasive "wheels" when cutting or dressing the ends of the cable housings will tend to introduce fine grit into the housing liner, simulating the effect of perhaps years and thousands of miles of riding in terms of the cable path's cleanliness.
Any friction in the system at all, as with a well-used rear-most cable housing segment, or with the cable running against the bare steel of a bottom bracket cable guide, causes the length of the long cable to change whenever the lever is moved (caused by the cable movement having to overcome static-friction force).
The most notorious cases of cable friction/elasticity occurred when stainless cables were used in the unlined coiled-stainless cable housings, but friction/elasticity problems can occur anywhere along the cable's path (though have their worst effect further from the shift lever).
Choice of cable lubricant can also be a factor, as cable-specific greases made from silicone and Teflon (as opposed to hydrocarbon) tend to give lowest friction along the cable's polymer-lined path from shifter to derailer. SRAM and Shimano both offer such (seemingly expensive) cable greases, but just a very light application along the cable wire is all that is needed for super-slick operation.
Try making slight movements of the shift lever, taking note of any tendency of the derailer not actually moving in response to these back-and-forth movements. This would be a definite indication of cable friction and elasticity causing the shifting to be unresponsive and/or feeling imprecise.
Lastly, any use of abrasive "wheels" when cutting or dressing the ends of the cable housings will tend to introduce fine grit into the housing liner, simulating the effect of perhaps years and thousands of miles of riding in terms of the cable path's cleanliness.
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09-06-23, 02:16 PM
#27
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09-07-23, 09:29 AM
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09-08-23, 09:26 AM
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There's a Campy 10sp cassette on this bike and it works great IMO.
09-08-23, 12:00 PM
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09-08-23, 12:06 PM
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The bar goes very quiet - then the sliding noise of one chair as Suntour Ratchet Friction stands up and turns toward rccardr...
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https://www.richardcmoeur.com/bikestuf.html
09-08-23, 01:06 PM
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…who then asks “Excuse me, aren’t you Grant Petersen? Of Rivendell fame?”
THAT should ensure another fifty pages or so for this thread…
THAT should ensure another fifty pages or so for this thread…
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09-08-23, 01:40 PM
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Some one has to do it: 
you could just go 9 speed indexed, I had 9 speed ultegra with Dura ace bar ends . Shifting was super nice, set up easy. Turns out I didn't like bar ends that much, but that is different story
https://www.performancebike.com/shim...xoCgq4QAvD_BwE
you could just go 9 speed indexed, I had 9 speed ultegra with Dura ace bar ends . Shifting was super nice, set up easy. Turns out I didn't like bar ends that much, but that is different story
https://www.performancebike.com/shim...xoCgq4QAvD_BwE
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Life is too short not to ride the best bike you have, as much as you can
(looking for Torpado Super light frame/fork or for Raleigh International frame fork 58cm)
09-09-23, 09:04 PM
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09-09-23, 09:25 PM
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Small barrel shifters with relatively long pull derailleurs will give you more precision. In other words, a Simplex shifter with a Shimano RD will work better than Suntour shifter with a Nuovo Record RD.
With modern ramped cogs, old fashioned derailleurs where the top pulley doesn't track to close to the cogs actually shifts better than a good index derailleur. The added distance makes derailleur position less critical, but the ramps still insure fast, positive shifts.
With modern ramped cogs, old fashioned derailleurs where the top pulley doesn't track to close to the cogs actually shifts better than a good index derailleur. The added distance makes derailleur position less critical, but the ramps still insure fast, positive shifts.
09-09-23, 09:39 PM
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First of all, tx for all the info, idea's, tales of woe, etc, etc.
This spurred me to decide to take the big silver daily driver Merz to Eroica
With its very well worn Campy 9 speed triple that some how still works just fine for me.
It had to be made Eroica compliant and having everything in stock, I proceeded to swap out bars, stem, brake, shift levers and cables as a unit.
On went Nitto noodles, NOS VO Grand Cru chrome steel stem, Origin 8/ TRP style levers, SunTour bar cons and good new slick, lined cables and housings.
The shift housing is ebay special from eastern europe that I used some Gore cable and liners with it but have used it without and it works well on regular friction too.
Dialed in on the stand with minimal drama, then out for a test ride, works great as it should and is ready to go.
Wrap the bars and see if I can get it up a couple of hills tomorrow to make sure and degrease, clean and lube
Take note of the very visible wear.
Tx again everyone.
This spurred me to decide to take the big silver daily driver Merz to Eroica
With its very well worn Campy 9 speed triple that some how still works just fine for me.
It had to be made Eroica compliant and having everything in stock, I proceeded to swap out bars, stem, brake, shift levers and cables as a unit.
On went Nitto noodles, NOS VO Grand Cru chrome steel stem, Origin 8/ TRP style levers, SunTour bar cons and good new slick, lined cables and housings.
The shift housing is ebay special from eastern europe that I used some Gore cable and liners with it but have used it without and it works well on regular friction too.
Dialed in on the stand with minimal drama, then out for a test ride, works great as it should and is ready to go.
Wrap the bars and see if I can get it up a couple of hills tomorrow to make sure and degrease, clean and lube
Take note of the very visible wear.
Tx again everyone.
Last edited by merziac; 09-09-23 at 09:54 PM.
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