dkoernert

I am looking for a new wheelset for my bike. I live in coastal Virginia so I'll be doing approximately zero climbing. Weight really isn't a huge concern for me. I want something that is going to be able to take a beating and keep rolling with little maintenance. I like the build Velomine offers with the Archetypes and CK hubs, but there don't seem to be but a handful of reviews on the rims themselves. Has anyone been riding Archetypes for a while? If so, what are your thoughts?

plpete

I have been riding them for some time. I actually built my very first wheel set with them. I went with the black rim on some SL novatec hubs and black Sapim Laser spokes and nipples. With a 20/24 spoke count the wheels came to 1500gr on the dot. I weigh about 165lbs now and will drop as the season progresses. Wheels have been great. The rim is nice and wide and I'm able to run about 85psi front and 90psi rear. Great comfort and overall performance. Of course that will differ for your weight. The black finish on the breaking track will eventually wear off but it does last quite long if you ride in dry conditions. One wet ride and most of it is gone. Breaking itself is very good. Rims themselves are known to be quite stout and east to build with.

This is straight from Fairwheel bikes site:
——————————————–
H+Son Archetype:
Weight: 472 grams.
Price: $80-$90 (depending on finish)
Depth: 25mm
Width: 23mm
Internal width: 17mm
Drillings: 20, 24, 28, 32, 36
Colors: Black, Hard Ano, Silver.
Thoughts: This is one of my favorite rims. Wide internal and external dimensions with a good 25mm depth, decent weight, decent price and good overall stiffness, make this an ideal everyday, any condition rider. The overall build and material quality is very high. Available in plenty of drillings and several finishes. I don’t like the black version of this rim because it’s anodized brake track does not hold up well to wear and it begins to look poor rather quickly. However the hard anodized version which is more of a grey finish holds up quite well. The hard ano also has more of a carbon rim look which may not appeal to everyone, but does appeal to me.
Eric: This rim is on my short list and with better distribution channels will be a good option to have. The hard anodizing surface is polarizing. Some people love the look of a well used set of anodized rims, others think it looks bad. With disc brake bikes becoming more popular for road/cross bikes, this problem is eliminated and the wheels will continue to have black sidewalls for the life of them.

dkoernert

Thanks for the reply, that is very helpful Feedback! That setup sounds really nice, maybe I'll try to build this set myself with the assistance of a seasoned wheel builder.

DoubleTap

I've been riding a set now for a little over a year. They were hand-built by a shop here in Portland, DT240 hubs, 32 spoke count. I forget which spokes they used. I'm a clyde at 250 lbs., and I don't baby them but I don't rip on them either. They've been flawless for me. I've not had to true them or otherwise maintain them, and I probably have around 3,000 miles on them now. I'll replace them with the same wheels when they wear out.

rousseau

I've been riding mine for half a year. Built them myself. They ride like a dream.

The details:

H Plus Archetype 28-hole: $150 Craigslist purchase
Miche Primato hubs 28-hole: $100 (Wiggle)
Spokes: About $100

The purty:

WhyFi

I've had mine for close to a year. I like them better than the A23s.

CharlyAlfaRomeo

What do you like about them better than the A23's? I'm considering both rims for a build in the near future.

Looigi

Some rim profiles. Wall thicknesses are not accurate. I have the HED and Pacenti rims illustrated.

WhyFi

I just like the profile better - looks nicer (IMO) and seems a little more stiff. If I remember right, the joints on the A23 are pinned while the H+ are welded.

canam73

I have wheelsets with both the A23s and the Kinlins from that diagram along with a PowerTap built on the older version of the HED that had dimensions more like the Kinlin.

If I were buying them all again they would all be the Kinlin. As un-built rims they were as true and well finished as even the HED. They do have a pinned or plugged joint, but none of the 4 rims I received had any kind of brake pulse, unlike my A23s which are welded (mine are the original Australian type, don't know how the USA's are joined).

I built a wheelset for myself and my brother to be used as high-mileage trainers and they have held up great over the 2 years they have been in use. The only dis-advantage I know is that they are the heaviest rim in that picture, but that doesn't bother me for a non-race rim especially if it gives me some extra durability or brake track life.

rpenmanparker 

I agree that the Kinlin rims are flatter and rounder than Velocity ones and have a smoother joint. The pinned joint on the Kinlins has absolutely no negatives the way they carry it out. What WhyFi says about appearance vs H Plus Son Archetype I can't challenge. That is a personal thing, and I haven't given the comparison much study. All I can say is that Kinlin rims build up easier for me than others, particularly Velocities.

CharlyAlfaRomeo

Right on, thanks.

dtrain

I'm right in this decision process myself. I have a nice set of hubs and am looking for a wide alloy rim. Trying to decide among HED C2 (are they worth the premium price?), Pacenti (pain in the butt to mount traditional tires?), a23 (quality?), Kinlins from BHS (quality?), and Archetypes (not wild about the 'finished' brake track). Geez...I guess that's pretty much every rim on the graphic. HED's and BHS's Kinlins are probably in the lead for me.

WhyFi

Heh - one wet ride should get enough grit on your brake pads to take care of that. I loved the black track, but it was gone in a couple of spring rides.

rpenmanparker 

Kinlins are filet mignon at a hamburger price. Some folks look down their nose at that , but I appreciate it.

dtrain

I appreciate value too. Still rolling a full 6600 group on my nicer bike...and plan to for some time (will skip 6700). I kinda like the gloss black finish over matte as I have wet black WCS bits on the bike.

SanDiegoSteve

I had a pair built up with some Chris King hubs. 28 front, 32 back; I'm 180 lbs. They are shiny silver and I kind of like the retro look.
Spin like butter and ride really nice with 23mm tires.

I didn't weigh them, but they are not much different weight wise than my Ksyrium ES, so I'd guess in the 1,500 gram range. Climbing feels the same.

They are stiff, but not harsh. I don't get annoying vibrations and there is no flex when I stand.
My last wheels had the big bladed spokes that would catch like a sail. Not too bad, but noticeable. I feel no side wind with these.
In non-scientific descending, they are as fast or a bit faster than my Ksyriums. It is hard to measure as when I look back on a ride, a stop light has more impact on average speed, but in 4 descents, they are averaging higher than the Ksyriums.

Only about 250 miles on them so far, so can't comment other than they look new.

rpenmanparker 

One other thing I should mention is I have never had a Kinlin rim (of maybe 20) that weighed more than the advertised nominal value. On the other hand of maybe 10 Velocity rims I have never had one that weighed less than the advertised nominal value. Too many data points to be just coincidence.

dtrain

Good feedback, SanDiegoSteve. I would also be replacing some Mavic's (SL) that I kinda like on my steel bike...but seem a little stiff/harsh on my carbon bike. I'm not racing or anything, so looking more for the comfort features of the wider rim and handbuilt wheel.

Chief Brody

I think Velomine also builds the Archetypes up on White Industries T11 hubs. Those might be worth a look unless your set on the CK hubs.

dkoernert

I'll be honest, the only reason I am looking at the CK hubs is for pure bling factor.

It looks like they added a few more options very recently. I hadn't looked at their site in a couple days and last time I looked, they only had the WI hubs in pink built up with the Archetypes. I have heard nothing but good things about those hubs.

dtrain

So I reached out to Jude of Sugar Wheel Works here in Portland. She's modestly endorcing the Archetypes. She gave them a slight edge (over the a23, sl23, and xc279) as an all-round, long-lasting, training rim.

rpenmanparker 

That's makes a lot of sense if she is going to build the wheels for you. She ought to work with what she approves. But if anyone else is going to build the wheels (you?), her opinion is not so relevant. The point is all of these rims are very high end goods. None of them are going to let you down. You are truly splitting hairs. So it is all about working with what you like when you are doing the building. You will never notice the difference in the riding.

dtrain

Yeah, I hear ya. She wasn't making much of the differences either. All very similar it seems.

Looigi

FWIW: I have not found the Pacenti rims that difficult to mount tires on. I mount tires on the set I have the same as I do on any other rims using talc and no tools. I do use thin rim tape which might make a small difference.