Trek Verve 3, numerous component downgrades/substitutions
#1
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Trek Verve 3, numerous component downgrades/substitutions
Stopped at a local Trek store to check out a Verve 3 disc- their best selling bike according to the sales guy. Most of the Verve 3's in stock had some level of component substitution, the store itself is very well stocked, probably had 3 in my large size but only one on the floor.
I knew that component substitutions can be a thing these days and wasn't too concerned when I saw the Kenda brand tires of the appropriate size instead of the Bontrager H5 hard case ultimates. I was a little alarmed when, instead of the Shimano MT200 brakes, I noticed a no-name brand attached. The wheels were also not the Bontrager Tubeless ready, but instead were another Bontrager component. The Trek Boulevard seat and grips had also been substituted with unbranded products.
So we're looking at five substituted components:
Brakes, Wheels, Tires, Seat, Grips
Two of these are what I would consider serious mechanical/quality downgrades, particularly no-name brakes instead of Shimano Hydraulics but the wheelset is definitely cheaper/lower-spec
The test ride was illuminating. Even when grabbing two fairly aggressive fists full of brakes, it would slowly coast down from about 10 mph in maybe 15 feet, eerily reminiscent of a kids bicycle with failed/failing coaster brakes. The rim brakes on my wife's 2014 crossroads (a 430 dollar bike at the time) are probably 3 or 4 times as strong.
I'm of the mind that it would be better for Trek to not ship this bike with those components if full price is expected. Brake performance may be an installation/adjustment issue also but I can't imagine even basic Shimano Hydraulics to be anywhere near that weak.
I knew that component substitutions can be a thing these days and wasn't too concerned when I saw the Kenda brand tires of the appropriate size instead of the Bontrager H5 hard case ultimates. I was a little alarmed when, instead of the Shimano MT200 brakes, I noticed a no-name brand attached. The wheels were also not the Bontrager Tubeless ready, but instead were another Bontrager component. The Trek Boulevard seat and grips had also been substituted with unbranded products.
So we're looking at five substituted components:
Brakes, Wheels, Tires, Seat, Grips
Two of these are what I would consider serious mechanical/quality downgrades, particularly no-name brakes instead of Shimano Hydraulics but the wheelset is definitely cheaper/lower-spec
The test ride was illuminating. Even when grabbing two fairly aggressive fists full of brakes, it would slowly coast down from about 10 mph in maybe 15 feet, eerily reminiscent of a kids bicycle with failed/failing coaster brakes. The rim brakes on my wife's 2014 crossroads (a 430 dollar bike at the time) are probably 3 or 4 times as strong.
I'm of the mind that it would be better for Trek to not ship this bike with those components if full price is expected. Brake performance may be an installation/adjustment issue also but I can't imagine even basic Shimano Hydraulics to be anywhere near that weak.
Last edited by Flipper_; 07-12-22 at 02:11 PM.
#2
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How convenient it was that Trek's "best selling" bike just happened to be the model he had in stock! As to components, it doesn't surprise me that there were substitutions, though no name brakes that didn't work well would stop me in my tracks (unintended pun). My bikes are older models but in great shape and do what I need, so not in the market. Am aware the small print says specs subject to change, but how much difference can there be before it's not even the "same" bike?! Glad I'm not shopping right now.
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Those brakes sound awful. Maybe because they were new and not properly bedded in?
The hydraulic Shimano's on my Trek FX Sport 4 can easily fully lock both wheels from 15 mph and put me into a skid, even at my weight (250 lbs). Happens once or twice a week when I panic stop to avoid a rabbit on the MUP I ride.
Mark
The hydraulic Shimano's on my Trek FX Sport 4 can easily fully lock both wheels from 15 mph and put me into a skid, even at my weight (250 lbs). Happens once or twice a week when I panic stop to avoid a rabbit on the MUP I ride.
Mark
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I gotta say..your text reads a lot like that coming from a Specialized dealer.
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Were the no-name brakes also hydraulic? Low-grade Shimano hydraulics are very strong. I have several sets on several bikes and they rival the best rim brakes for sheer stopping power, and should be able to slide the rear tire in a skid. I don't think I've ever found that much power with cable operated disc brakes, but proper bedding is important for all disc brakes, cable or hydraulic. It's possible the pads and rotors were "green" and hadn't been bedded. And, yes, it does make a real difference!
#6
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As to components, it doesn't surprise me that there were substitutions, though no name brakes that didn't work well would stop me in my tracks (unintended pun). ….. how much difference can there be before it's not even the "same" bike?! Glad I'm not shopping right now.
Those brakes sound awful. Maybe because they were new and not properly bedded in?
The hydraulic Shimano's on my Trek FX Sport 4 can easily fully lock both wheels from 15 mph and put me into a skid, even at my weight (250 lbs). Happens once or twice a week when I panic stop to avoid a rabbit on the MUP I ride.
Mark
The hydraulic Shimano's on my Trek FX Sport 4 can easily fully lock both wheels from 15 mph and put me into a skid, even at my weight (250 lbs). Happens once or twice a week when I panic stop to avoid a rabbit on the MUP I ride.
Mark
Were the no-name brakes also hydraulic? Low-grade Shimano hydraulics are very strong. I have several sets on several bikes and they rival the best rim brakes for sheer stopping power, and should be able to slide the rear tire in a skid. I don't think I've ever found that much power with cable operated disc brakes, but proper bedding is important for all disc brakes, cable or hydraulic. It's possible the pads and rotors were "green" and hadn't been bedded. And, yes, it does make a real difference!
I
Last edited by Flipper_; 06-29-22 at 07:19 AM.
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Nope. I think a proper specced Verve 3 should be the bike to beat. I still own an older Specialized Crossroads- plus a Fuel EX8 which I couldn’t love more and which has literal brick-wall stopping performance from it’s SRAM G2-R discs. What’s your take on 5 component subs at full MSRP?
The reason for my previous comment is that most members here that have been around for a while see new posters roll in and with hair on fire & the sky is falling posts proclaiming some injustice or other. When someone (new) with some technical knowledge lays out an "issue" as you have they may well come here with an agenda. Had a regular, longer term member posted your issue, it would be accepted as a simple observation..take from it as you will.
I does sound like the bike you tested has some braking issues. Bike shops vary in their abilities or care in setting up new bikes. Something being not quite right on a new bike isn't new, or unusual. It is what it is and whomever ends up buying the bike will work through it one way or another. If you don't like the setup or cost of the Verve 3..buy something else.
#9
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I just bought a Verve 2 a few days ago and it also had subbed out parts. I know the brakes are something like the power ones mentioned above, and also the seat, grips, and maybe stem. The brakes are not very responsive and I am going to be taking the bike in for an adjustment in a couple of weeks.
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I suspect this is the new reality for lower end bikes which use cheaper components, as the supply chain shrivels. With China sticking to the zero COV policy, it's going to be a while before things normalize.
#11
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They may resemble these and are probably knock-offs of the Shimano brakes. They're almost certainly not fitted with genuine Shimano pads, but with one of the many off-brands available on the internet. In other words, I think the pads sucked and were not bedded to the rotors. The rotors were likely not genuine Shimano rotors, either. I personally own genuine Shimano, genuine Tektro, and knock-off rotors, and the genuine stuff is demonstrably better. It all adds up to braking performance that won't be on par with what you'd get from the real thing.
The mfgs also know that the vast majority of people buying a bike like the Verve 3 aren't going to realize the degree of substitution being made(or even notice), or understand whether the substituted components are markedly better or worse than the published spec..and in the end, even care.
Assembly and performance is on the shop and whichever mechanic let that out of the work area. Value and integrity is squarely on Trek and this experience seems notably deficient in both. I may yet buy a Verve 3 or FX 3, would even consider the shop, but it won't be with trash components.
Last edited by Flipper_; 06-30-22 at 10:33 AM.
#13
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I didn't buy the bike or even really do a thorough test ride. After I showed their salesman the brake issue I left to post breathlessly on the interwebz. I'm still considering the Verve, Dual Sport and FX bikes though, trying to make sure that I get the right profile between these machines, often with similar mechanicals. I have a great mountain bike and a basic but very functional comfort bike so I'm still searching, just irritated at the perceived value from Trek and attention to detail from the shop.
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Ah ok. Have you looked at Canyon, Giant or Cube? They may not be as hampered with supply chain issues. If the geometry and other criteria fits, I think you should broaden the search.
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#16
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-I think the subs are bad enough that I could just as well have bought a Verve 2
-now looking at hybrids like the FX and Sirrus anyhow
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#17
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I’m going to have to learn everything I can about components so that when it comes time to go to an LBS for my new hybrid I get what I actually came for.
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Trek Verve 3
I just bought a trek verve 3 April 2024 and when it came into my local bike shop, they called me and of course I took the spec sheet with me and I found two or three items that were substituted. There are still in process of setting Bike up and I told him this is unacceptable to me for the price I’m being charged for this model bike!! otherwise I would’ve bought verve 1 or verve 2 … the owner of this shop handled it for me. He called trek customer service and submitted a claim under warranty to them from him to get the correct parts replaced my shop/dealer which is an authorized TREK dealer.. he then told me if they didn’t make it right he would I’m in Southern Oregon in the United States America , and I really appreciate the Trek Bike Kraft shop and Grants Pass, Oregon they are stand up peoples
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