LarrySellerz

Says the dude asking who "they" are

LarrySellerz

I'm far above average for my age and location, but the bar is extremely low. Nobody my age knows how to build things

big john

I think any classes involving mechanical work or electronics, etc. can be invaluable to young people. When I was in high school we had shop classes and I as interested in electronics and took semesters of T.V. repair and even took extra summer classes on T.V. repair. Never had an auto shop class but ended up as a car mechanic and all that electronic stuff helped me as cars became computers and electric motors.

Of course there isn't a huge demand for bicycle mechanics but understanding and wrenching on a simple machine like a bike could be good for a lot of people.
I am of the opinion that not every cyclist should do their own repairs. There are plenty of good road riders who struggle to put in a tube.

I worked at an occupational center for a couple years as an automotive instructor, mostly for high school students. Some of them got something out of the classes and some had no business picking up a wrench. Some people can not do mechanical work, not event the simplest tasks.

Even at new car dealers, guys would get hired on and have absolutely no ability to work with their hands. None.

And for saying the technology is changing, yes, that's how it works. When I first worked on a car they were very different than they became. You have to start somewhere. The basics will stay the same with bikes, as with cars.

LarrySellerz

This is exactly what im talking about. With the robotics classes, more and more building of the electronics is outsourced to private companies, and the robotics classes will buy "plug and play" components. When something breaks, it is more economical to buy a new one. The manufacurers don't even provide schematics iike they used to in order to to fix stuff even if you wanted to, look at how much harder its gotten to replace say a laptop screen in the last 10 years.

Its not a replacement for the shop class that you taught, not even close, and the kids will be on their laptops for most of it

big john

Some men have no business trying to use tools.

Eric F 

I'm not the one making claims of conspiracy based on weak conjectures.

Eric F 

Truth. Meanwhile, some women do great business with tools.

big john

You sound like the people who say "nobody wants to work".

big john

lol. Actually, when I taught at a private school one of the best students was a woman. I taught the classes to get them ready to get a smog license and she got her license before any of the guys. She had a very good understanding of the material.

At the dealership we had high school students as trainees. They would come in after school and during summer. I was assigned a girl and she was sharp. Since I was a stressed out jerk at work I made her cry. She forgave me and ended up working as a manager in a Pep Boys parts warehouse. She came to visit and told me about it.

tomato coupe

Apparently, Larry gets his news and information from South Park.

big john

Not the worst source.

3alarmer

...why did I immediately picture chain saws ?

3alarmer

...I've followed the right to repair debate almost from its inception. My impression is that it is about the information resources available to the general public, at reasonable cost, about any given product (but mostly focused around cars and farm machinery.) The information to repair a relatively expensive farm implement, (like a harvest combine), is important to the farm economy, since the alternative is often to lose days at a critical period of harvest, taking the ******g thing back to the dealer for repair. This is not the same thing as mechanical education, which is presumed to exist at some level.

Ag mechanics is still pretty much of a going thing LarrySellerz . Drive over across the coast range to the Central Valley sometime, and you'll discover a whole other world of wrenching. You have to drive to Reno for the wenching, though.

3alarmer

...Sweet Jesus, Larry. This is old man talk about how bad the kidz are these days. How the hell old are you, anyway ?

LarrySellerz

27

big john

You're a fan of Darwin?

mstateglfr 

The South Park special was funny. But let's not pretend that what happens on South Park is actually representative of reality. In that special, Cartman is sent to a similar reality in the multiverse and handymen compete in a space race for the uberwealthy.
It's just a cartoon that makes fun of Disney, billionaires, and our reliance on AI. Nothing more.

rsbob 

Instead of bike mechanics, I would favor classes in critical thinking and financial management. If one learns to think critically, they can probably figure out how to maintain a bike - or if all else fails, watch YouTube.

Maelochs

LOL .... teaching people to use logic to decide what opinions make sense and to evaluate one's thoughts, instead of learning "logic" to justify one's opinions?

Teaching kids to manage money, deal with multiple credit cards, make simple investments?

Dude, you can't raise sheep that way!

smd4

Gotta agree. I think our love of bikes is influencing our thinking here. Bicycling has no place as a high school class.

I also like model railroading. In model railroading, you need geometry skills (track layout), electrical skills, mechanical skills, architectural knowledge, carpentry skills--a plethora of skills useful in "real life." Do I think "model railroading" should be a high school class? Of course not.

Just becaue we think bikes are "really cool" doesn't mean they belong as a high school subject. rsbob is 100% correct here.

mstateglfr 

You are creating a false choice here. It doesnt need to be this or that, both can exist. Furthermore, many districts in my metro and state have financial literacy classes as a HS graduation requirement. I can confidently list a dozen districts in my metro that require it because its the same curriculum and distributed by our AEA. I know for sure of 3 large districts elsewhere in the state that also use the curriculum so I know its distributed/managed by other state AEAs and can comfortably assume it is therefore also in use elsewhere(though no idea to what extent).
Anyways, I say this to clearly show that financial literacy and management already exists and is even a requirement in some districts. That doesnt mean you cant still have an elective class where the subject is Applied Mechanics and students work on and learn about how various simple machines work. Once more, bicycle maintenance could just be one section of this class. And tied to it could be lessons on understanding gear ratios(which is helpful to more than just bike nerds) and physics(mechanical drag, aero drag, energy dispersement, etc).


3 years of Social Studies are required for graduation and 'Personal Financial Literacy' is one of the required courses within Social Studies. This is to comply with a state law(which means all HS students in the state have to take and pass such a class).
Now obviously the text below is for my state and that doesnt mean its everywhere in this country. But that isnt the point. The point is that Financial Literacy can be a required class for graduation AND a class where bike mechanics is taught can also exist. Thats the point and I am bringing it back up so goalposts dont move.





This thread is bonkers. Its filled with posters continually not thinking creatively and ignorantly shooting down something based on fundamental misunderstanding.

"We shouldnt do that, we should do this other thing instead since its more important!"
"But that other thing is already being done and both can exist."
"Um..."

smd4

Um...exactly how many hours are in a day? In a school day? Sadly, it's simply a fact that NOT EVERY SUBJECT can be taught in high school. There is a limit. Sometimes you just can't DO BOTH.

And "Bicycling" shouldn't be one of them.

smd4

"Financial Management" classes are far more important than a "Bicycling" class, because such classes might enable students to garner enough money to actually be able to afford what passes for a decent bike today.

big john

I have to disagree. There are brilliant people, successful people, people with massive intellectual backgrounds, who cannot maintain a bike, change a faucet washer, or perform basic mechanical tasks.
It's not a question of intelligence, some people just aren't wired to work with their hands.

big john

Whether it's working on bikes or cars or metal shop or whatever I think it is good to expose young people to some form of mechanical tasks. It might enrich their lives, might help them to cope with the future.