Calsun

A lot depends on what is around you. I see photos and have watched videos of cyclist on nice trails through pastures and woods in the UK and this is far from what is around my house within an hour drive time. What I have are technical trails which require a mountain bike of some sort.

Folding bikes are heavy and not something I would want to pull out of a car trunk. There is a couple that have traveled for years with their folding bikes and will fly into a city and then use the bikes by themselves or put them on a bus or train as part of their trip. I can see a lot of value in their approach. If I lived in Europe it would be a no-brainer.

An intermediate bike can be created by adding a dropper post to a gravel bike. I did this and total cost for the post and lever and labor was under $400. Being able to lower the seat out of the way made my stability a good deal better on rough surfaces.

veganbikes

As a budget bike I guess nice would be sensible but once you get a chance to ride quality mid-drives with nicer drivetrains and brakes you understand. Anytime you see listed under parts like say brakes and it says "hydraulic" that is never a great sign. If you cannot actually list the parts on it and go through it generically they are probably the lowest cost for them they can find. You can certainly enjoy it and have fun on it and if that is what you know then it is going to be great. E-bikes and e-mopeds can be quite fun in any level but many of my customers in the past would buy the lower initial cost stuff and then realize what they liked about it and what they didn't like and then move up from there but some people just don't know what is missing because they haven't seen what is out there or have no frame of reference to understand it.

Please understand this is all more generic talk not specifically directed at you and not in any negative capacity but just having been doing this for 8 years or so and seeing the e-bike market change and grow and having worked with some many customers new and old I can see it all more holistically.

I remember when Aventonton sold just low initial cost aluminum "track" bikes.

70sSanO

If you don't have a gravel ebike, just get that. I have my doubts that you are really interested in spending money on a non-ebike, especially for gravel.

Just buy one and go out and enjoy it.

John

PeteHski

I would simply put some gravel friendly tyres on your Domane and get out there. If you enjoy it then you can get a dedicated gravel bike.

Dudelsack 

E-bikes are for sissies.

I’m kidding. 2/3 of my bikes are E-bikes, and the only one I’m riding now is my Lectric Xpedition.

if I had to do it over again, I’d get a fat wheel bike that I can ride on the sand. I ride the Xpedition on gravelly stuff and very shallow sand, and it holds its own but it belongs on the streets. Deep sand? No bueno.

Hope that helps.

PS I live on the beach, so a sand-traveling bike would have made a lot of sense.

Smaug1

Around me, without driving, I have cracked up roads, some paved trails and gravel trails. Some sandy trails too, but not usually deep. There are a very few miles of technical single track built for mountain bikes, but not enough to warrant a bike purchase.

If I drive an hour, there are a lot of proper mountain bike trails in a very hilly area.

If I’m willing to drive half a day, there are no end of gravel roads and trails.

The cyclist-quality e-bikes are getting lighter. A Trek Domane+ weighs under 30 lbs, for example. There are also lower-end ebikes that are light; usually single speeds with a modest power

Smaug1

My first eBike was a heybike Ranger; a folding 4x20” eFatty. Even that wouldn’t do deep sand. It would do anything BUT deep sand though!

I think most people that live near a beach ride more on paths that happen to have sand on them and packed wet sand.

Nachoman

That seems like quite a good deal for that bike. And it also comes in a road version. But fyi it appears to only come in a size 50cm or 56cm, in case that matters to you.

Wildwood 

Dump the Varsity, get a nice vintage roadie. Call it a nostalgia upgrade. With the savings from your $2500 budget, take a cycling vacation this summer.

Tomm Willians

It might take some looking to find one at your price point but I’ll suggest a Fazua powered E gravel bike. Reason being is you can drop the motor and battery like a massive AA unit thus lightening the bike by about 7.5 lbs. it then becomes a perfectly normal bike.
I ride a 2023 Pivot E Vault that I traded (partially) my 2022 Specialized Diverge for. I recently experienced an involved back surgery that requires recovery and therapy and the E bike option worked perfectly. I’ve worked myself back to 50+ miles without the motor and increasing every ride.
As I get older the motor will likely have more use so no need to invest again when that day comes.
Many manufacturers use the Fazua other than Pivot so you’ll have choices. The wife bought a used 2019(?) Trek Domane Plus with this motor and paid around $2500.

Iride01 

You say your $2500 budget doesn't support a gravel bike with a CF frame. However Specialized and Trek have some that have a CF frame and 11 speed Shimano or SRAM groups on them. I imagine other places do too. Might be just spring sale pricing, but they do offer you another choice to complicate this hard decision you must make.

Or are you wanting top of the line electronic shifting and other top tier components?

Smaug1

Yes, I've been thinking hard on that one. My gravel racing buddy at work says more and more of them are allowing eBikes. However, my Trek Domane is 54. I think I could probably tune the 56 to fit by changing the bar & stem, but I'm just not sure. I don't have enough experience in that kind of thing. I asked them about return policy: If I put very few miles on it, can I return it? If so, how much would that cost me? The answer was: "Yes, and there's a $300 return shipping cost" Seems like a gamble.


That is beautiful, with the lugged frame and all, but the gas pipe Schwinn is the one that holds the nostalgic value for me.


Interesting idea, but used eBikes are kind of risky; one never knows the condition of the battery, which is usually a min. $500 part. New ones start at 3800 Euro

I have a fellow club member who just upgraded his Domane+ from a previous 40 lb. model to a current 28 lb. model. I think it's a size too big for me though.
How did you determine the battery health before buying, or did you just accept the risk?


Thanks, I will look into that. I don't need electric shifting and could even forgo hydraulic brakes. I don't think I want a 30 lb. bike though. I see that entry level carbon gravel bikes are at the top of my budget. I looked at a couple Trek Checkpoints at a LBS this weekend, and I really like the SL5. I don't have a preference between SRAM or Shimano really, but I DO have a preference for a nice low climbing gear, and that either means changing out the chainring on a single chainring model and crippling the top end or a dual chainring model like the SL5.

I think my next step will be to go to the Trek shop that sponsors my local bike club and see what they can do for me on an SL5, and also see what steel gravel bikes he can get. That Norco I found seems PERFECT, the trick is getting one, as they don't have many dealers. Here in WI, most bikes shops just have Trek and Trek daughter products.

My colleague wisely pointed out that I should take a look on ebay for a used steel gravel bike; I might be surprised what I find.

Tomm Willians

My Pivot was new when purchased thus no battery concerns. The Diverge was traded in towards the final cost.
ahhh…… I think you meant the wife’s Trek? We took a complete risk and it worked out perfectly. The previous owner said it had minimal use but you never know.

Iride01 

I thought a regular gravel bike that isn't a e-bike was still part of the choices you were mulling over. Those won't be 30 lb. A Specialized Diverge with CF frame is just over 20 lbs I think. And I don't consider it's 11 speed Shimano 105 entry level. I wouldn't even consider Tiagra entry level. They perform almost as well as DuraAce or Ultegra. However they don't have the weight savings of those groups.

And how much lower gearing do you need? This Diverge gives you a 40 front and 42 rear sprocket. I'd think you could pull stumps out of the ground with that! <exaggeration><grin>

https://www.specialized.com/us/en/di...=350266-217055

Smaug1

Yes, a regular (modern) gravel bike won't be over 30 lbs. Some of the steel ones by Surly and Salsal are right around 30 lbs, but they are more touring bikes that take wider tires than gravel bikes. I like that they have triple chainrings for super-low gearing.

From the specs on that page, it seems like it's a SRAM Apex, rather than Shimano 105.

Admittedly, I'm not a strong climber.
My Domane is 1:1 and I've run into a couple hills that really kicked my ass. One really steep one where I almost was walking. If there had been another hill like that, I'd have been walking for sure. No bail-out gear available.

That Specialized has a 40/42 low gear = 0.95:1 drive; only slightly better for climbing those really steep hills.
The competing Trek SL5 30/34 was better, at 0.88:1

↑ Those are both on the racier end of gravel bikes.

Iride01 

Oops! I was looking at several different models of Specialized and Trek. I either linked the wrong Diverge or I still had a different brand or model with 105 still on my mind. I don't know anything much about SRAM to say if Apex is thought of as strictly entry level stuff. But I don't think 12 speed has been around long enough with anybody for that to make us consider 11 speed as being entry level.

And that particular Diverge wasn't the only one at your max budget. And there are different models too besides diverge. And all of them had the same framesets with lesser components on them at way lower prices. Other versions have 2x and some 3x cranks.

But my intent here is not to sway you to the Diverge or any other bike. I was just taking exception to your statement that you couldn't get a decent CF gravel bike for $2500.

Smaug1

Update: I just ordered the Priority Apollo 11 Gravel:
https://www.prioritybicycles.com/pro...y-apollo#specs




I decided after all this consideration that not having to do chain maintenance is more valuable to me than all the other stuff I've been deliberating on. (esp. with gravel duty)

Key specs (to me):

• Shimano Alfine 11 IGH is clean & low maintenance (oil change every couple years)
• 24 lbs.
• Cable-actuated hydraulic disc brakes
• Aluminum frame, carbon fork. I figure in a gravel bike, the 40 mm tires have more to do with the ride.
• Front axle: thru
• Rear axle: slow-change (axle nuts)

I can adjust a bit with seat position and maybe a different bar/reach if needed.

I ruled out the:

• extra folding eBike, because for now, my uses are imagined and few. I may get another one one day. We'll see.
• carbon gravel eBike because it doesn't seem like it'll fit me in either size they have. 50 cm will be way too small and 56 cm will be a bit too big. (will rack my crotch on stand-over, if nothing else)
• steel gravel bike, because they just don't seem worth the premium and it would not be that much different from my Domane.

This one should make a cracking commuter (I commute almost every day in most weather on bikes) and a good gravel bike too.

Thanks for all your help!

Smaug1

I took this bike for its inaugural ride Saturday. I was quite surprised how much more effort it is on the road compared to my Domane. This ride I joined was a regular coffee ride I've been going on, as they ride year 'round. They are a relaxed pace group, usually averaging 12-13 mph. This particular morning, on the south route, we had a 14 mph tailwind, so that pace was 16-17 mph I was at full steam to keep up. (160-170 pulse range) The 700c x 40 tires were aired up to 40 / 45 psi; that felt plenty firm but still gave a nice ride. Max. allowed by Goodyear on the tire was 55 psi.

Other possible sources of drag:

• Derailleur gears are also 5-6% more efficient on average than on my Alfine 11 [SOURCE] (although only 3-4% in the lower gears, which is the way I like it)
  
  
• Belt vs. chain efficiency is about even
• Not mentioned often, but I was riding in 30 - 35 °F temperature; I wonder if the oil in the hub was thicker, causing some loss too?
• I bet the new belt is a bit more stiff than one that is run in.

I was thinking of doing gravel races with this bike. I'm not a fit or strong enough rider to be competitive anyway, but this is going to take me down another notch

The bars are a bit of a reach and a bit low for my taste; I will probably fit a taller and shorter stem, as well as replace the bar tap over some gel pads. (I have that in my Domane and it was maybe the best addition for comfort)
Over time, the seat was less comfortable than my Selle X-2; I think I will buy another of those.

b88

My Specialized 20lb gravel ebike handles like a tank. When powered off and riding, it is a tank.

Smaug1

Update: I got a couple rides in and decided to fit the bike better to me. The bar reach was a bit low and forward for me, so I looked in my parts box and found a stem with a bit of rise.

I've never taken a head apart before, so I think you more experienced mechanics know what's coming.

I put the bike up on the rack and spun the rear wheel. There's a spot on the brake disc that's dragging. I haven't looked into how to fix that, but I gather that it can be fixed. (not sure if I'm up to the job though...) I removed the top cap. Then loosened the stem clamp bolts and you know what happened next: the fork, tube and innards from the stem all fell out on the floor. I lost one of the spacers, so I can't get it back together now.

I mostly have it figured out, but there's one flat washer that I can't tell for sure where it goes. Can you advise me on that please? All I know for sure is that it doesn't go by the bottom bearing; it's too small for the taper.

I wrote to Priority bicycles and asked them if I could buy another spacer. (yes, for $1.) I asked about a higher stem, and he offered me that at a discount, $23. I also asked about a smaller front pulley. (yes, ~$65) The low gear SEEMS low enough, but I'm not sure and I want to have a plenty low enough low gear to climb like a mountain goat. I'm a little fat and am planning several long gravel rides this year. The high gear is higher than I'll ever need on a gravel bike.

I'm on the fence as to whether to consult YouTube University and tackle this myself or just bring it all and support the LBS and know it's done right.

It just occurred to me that I should buy a spare belt. If I snap one I'll be walking for sure, as these belts aren't in stock anywhere.

I was pleased to find that the bike included a nice quality 15 mm combo wrench. (needed for the rear axle nuts) The included hex keys are too short, but nice quality. I guess I'll bring a multi-tool and leave those at home. I need to order another mounting bracket for the Park Tool pump I have on my Domane.