bluefoxicy

https://www.npr.org/2011/07/11/137761...-crash-carnage

Even the French can't drive.

Bacciagalupe

The professional pelotons have dozens of cars and motorcycles accompanying the riders in close quarters.

These vehicles are vital to the safety and success of the riders, and include: team cars (food, coaching), race officials, media, neutral repair services, team and race doctors, and police.

It is exceedingly rare for a motor vehicle to collide with a rider. In fact, there have been nearly a dozen crashes in this year's TdF which were caused by the riders and had nothing to do with any motor vehicles.

The driver should have stayed a little further back from the cyclists. Otherwise there is no real "larger lesson" from this incident, especially from an A&S perspective.

pcfxer

Firstly, we all understand accidents happen.

To excuse the driver at all in any shape or form demonstrates that you probably didn't watch the same race as myself. The cyclists were up in front and ALONE with a lot of room to spare on either side. The driver of the car CRANKED the wheel INTO the cyclists for NO REASON.

Assumptions: Driver afraid of off-roading := proper training says to keep the wheel straight and gradually move the vehicle safely onto the roadway keeping one's eyes directed to where they want to go.

2nd fail: Motorcycle...wtf? GTFO of the way. Why does he have to be so close to get the "best shot?"

digger

The driver swerved to avoid a tree. Watch it again, you'll see. It wasn't for "no reason."

It appears the driver was trying to pass the cyclists (for whatever reason), was probably concentraing on the cyclist and not looking far enough ahead. He noticed the tree and instead of stopping, swerved. Stopping would most likely cause the motorcyclist behind him to slam into his rear (maybe).

So,. it wasn't intention, it was a stupid mistake.

jbkirby

Indeed, a dumb mistake, but a costly one. Each year, more vehicles seem to be allowed.

crhilton

https://velonews.competitor.com/2011/...stage-9_183085

They were told not to pass, did it anyway and caused a wreck. It's clear cut, not an "accident" and not okay.

There's nothing to learn here except that the driver should never be allowed to operate a vehicle at a UCI race ever again. And his company should probably be severely fined.

Bacciagalupe

That's the ASO covering its A**.

The TV car was already in front of the two team cars, who effectively blocking the road behind them. If we believe that the team car needed to get *cough* NEXT TO THE RIDERS *cough,* the TV car didn't have a lot of options. It certainly couldn't come to a dead stop or pull off to the side at 30mph without causing an even worse crash.

Pro cyclists ride next to cars all the time. They draft off of cars, they talk to their team DS's, they talk to race doctors, they retrieve food and drinks all the time while cruising at 30+ mph. The problem isn't "cars next to pro cyclists," it's that for whatever reason, the TV car driver swerved when he was too close to the cyclists.

And again, this has bupkis to do with the kind of safety issues that ordinary cyclists deal with on a regular basis.

bluefoxicy

I know seriously. Most of us have never been on a road with a motorized vehicle at all! Those ebikes aren't really popular yet because they're so expensive...

crhilton

I don't think those red LCL cars are Europcar team cars. It might be the ASO covering its ass. Either way, the driver had an easy out: Look up the ****ing road and notice the tree coming up before you try to pass.

gpsblake

Amazing this doesn't happen more often with all the cars involved in the tour. This is a rare accident and if we want coverage of the Tour, you got to have the camera cars. Horrible accident and the driver has been expelled. Don't know what more to do.

KD5NRH

So where are all these "vital" vehicles in other races?

Even NASCAR makes pit stops when the car needs a repair or the driver needs a drink. If everybody has to stop to get a fresh water bottle, then it's not giving anybody an unfair advantage unless camels learn to ride bicycles.

Besides, making them wait a bit longer for a spare bike might discourage some of the weight-savings shortcuts that lead to the disappearing front wheels, splintering forks and other things that seem to happen every time the Tour route has a slight rough spot.

bluefoxicy

Take the weight penalty for a 3L camelbak and an ice vest; swap the reservoir on pit stops. Win Tour de France. FIFA makes it illegal next year.

eja_ bottecchia

Why do you automatically assume the driver is French? French drivers are generally OK. Can't say the same for drivers in Hong Kong.

genec

NASCAR is not exactly an open road type race like TDF... if a "pit" were available, then no doubt "pit stops" could be made. Just a quick check shows that NASCAR is all done on tracks.

Of course on the flip side, perhaps some long multi-day bike race could be setup on some big track somewhere... racers could then come in and "pit" their bikes... somehow I have a feeling they'd just exchange one bike for another, rather than change tires... etc.

Even Le Mans is on a track. Races that are not done on tracks, but in cities, such as Long Beach, require the streets to be closed and they are configured like a track.

Is there any sort of open road race event like TDF, for automobiles? The only thing I can think of that is even remotely similar is the Baja 1000... and there are plenty of support vehicles.

Bacciagalupe

Dude. Seriously.

Motor vehicles that are riding in the middle of a pro peloton are hyper-aware of the cyclists, and they are there specifically to support the riders. In contrast, when a car passes me on a busy road, they are rarely looking for cyclists and most certainly aren't there to hand me a water bottle.

Neither the riders nor the car were operating under the parameters of ordinary driving. You might as well point to a Formula 1 race as evidence that "speeding is bad."

Absolutely nothing about this unfortunate accident has any bearing whatsoever on how ordinary cyclists and ordinary cars should deal with each other on the road.


Dude. Seriously.

Unless you're making a joke, you have absolutely no concept of how pro races work.

You've got almost 200 riders covering 3400km over 21 stages. That's an average of 163km per day, with many stages over 200k. There is no way you could operate a grand tour without extensive motorized support.

Nor do you show any awareness that this is an exceedingly rare event. From what I can tell, a car hasn't hit a TdF cyclist since 1977.

Meanwhile, crashes caused by other cyclists have done far more damage this year, and have claimed: Chris Horner, Vino, Bradley Wiggins, Brajkovic, Tom Boonen, Zabriskie.... all knocked out with serious injuries by crashes that had nothing to do with motor vehicles.

Feel free to come on back when you actually know what you're talking about.

Bacciagalupe

Criterium races are done on large loops. Bike races would essentially be ruined if they were limited to 50k loops.

And it wouldn't make it even the tiniest bit safer. Again, motor vehicles almost never crash with the bikes.


There are still some events like the Monte Carlo rally.

KD5NRH

They're bicycles. A pit is anywhere you can have some guy holding a spare bike.

I don't know of any other multi-day races, but there are certainly road races. Generally, support consists of somebody pushing your broke-down race car off the road and the sheriff telling you when the wrecker will be allowed on the track to get it. Some drivers do have support vehicles, but obviously, if the support could keep up with the race car, they'd be racing it instead of wasting it on support; by the time it catches up to do anything, it's too late to have a decent standing in the race.

A similar method for the TdF would be to keep running the drinks motorcycles, neutral support and some roadside water, and keep the team cars at the stage start and finish unless they're called out. Break your bike beyond Mavic's ability to roadside repair it and you're pretty much toast for the stage. No all that different from most other forms of racing, really.

genec

When I wrote that I was thinking of the multi-day bike races that were considered all the rage at the turn of the last century... They were done on tracks and indeed had pit stops. Madison Square Garden used to be the site for such races... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six-day_racing

Rare events indeed. I would be quite willing to bet there are "support vehicles" during Monte Carlo. Don't know for sure though.

Northwestrider

Watching the one biker thrown onto the barb wire fence made me cringe, Im happy that as I understand it, all were not seriously hurt.

gpsblake

And that wreck wasn't even the worst one of the day. There was one far worse that didn't occur on camera that took out 30 riders and ended up breaking Alexandr Vinokourov's femur and pelvis.

seeker333

All the crashes here. Hoogerland really got tore up in that fence. Check the dog crash video - the rider's front wheel collapses as if the dog had a "force field".

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...mj8H_blog.html

bluefoxicy

Hey, he said have them pit stop every time they need a drink. Forget that, too many stops; the weight penalty of carrying 3L of water is far better, and swapping off the reservoir (or whole pack) makes sense.

And have you ridden with an ice vest? I rode my bike in the rain and was like holy crap, I'm Lance friggin' Armstrong! Rushed up the hills, slung my bike around like a 50cc dirt bike, got home not even a little winded, could have gone all day like that. Man, once you start sucking the heat away it's like you've become Bicycle Jesus. This is what my car must feel like when the coolant system isn't boiling over.

Roughstuff

<<The professional pelotons have dozens of cars and motorcycles accompanying the riders in close quarters.>>

How the TDF is supposed to promote cycling when the race is so hopelessly dependent on....HORRORS! the automobile, has escaped me. I'll bet the TDF has a bigger carbon footprint than the Indy 500.

roughstuff

KD5NRH

Concordes almost never crash at all. How's that working out for France?

jakub.ner

Except for a rather large tree right against the pavement.