Pressure washed my bike... is it really really bad?
#26
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Sealed cartridge bearings aren't 100% waterproof. If you submerge them regularly or if you spray high pressure spray at them, water will get in and contiminate the inside of the bearing. The reason why automotive bearings last for so long is because of the design and how they are positioned inside the actual wheel hub. The hub and various seals and shields, protect the bearing from dirt and water intrusion under normal driving conditions. What will shorten the lifespan of automotive bearings is going off road and driving through deep water and deep mud frequently....The bearing used on bicycle bottom brackets and hubs are not really protected very well and if you point a high pressure spray at them water will get inside. That's why full fenders can extend the life of bottom bracket and headset bearing because they prevent road spray from going directly sprayed at the bearings. The fender acts as a shield.
#27
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Standard Operating Procedure in Tucson, Arizona, in the 1970s, was to blast the drivetrain at the car wash, pointing the nozzle at the back of the freewheel to make the chain spin around backwards so it all gets cleaned. If you were quick, you could rinse and 'wax', before the time ran out. Then, bounce the bike around a bit to shake the big drops off, get on, and ride it home, by which time it will be dry, and ready to oil.
It works on white (or any color) Tressostar or other quality cloth handlebar tape, too.
It works on white (or any color) Tressostar or other quality cloth handlebar tape, too.
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#28
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What about the Muc Off pressure washer? Anyone have experience with using that pressure washer? Muc Off claims the lighter pressure will not damage the bearings or damage the paint. Interested to hear some real world experiences.
#29
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Would be interesting to see if they offer any type of guarantee with that.
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#30
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The reason why automotive bearings last for so long is because of the design and how they are positioned inside the actual wheel hub. The hub and various seals and shields, protect the bearing from dirt and water intrusion under normal driving conditions. What will shorten the lifespan of automotive bearings is going off road and driving through deep water and deep mud frequently....
The bearing used on bicycle bottom brackets and hubs are not really protected very well and if you point a high pressure spray at them water will get inside. That's why full fenders can extend the life of bottom bracket and headset bearing because they prevent road spray from going directly sprayed at the bearings. The fender acts as a shield.
Going further, I see the roughest of rough bikes at my local co-ops. If anything is going to fail, these are the places to see it. I seldom see a cartridge bearing bottom bracket that is even rough, much less damaged. I would estimate the number of bottom brackets that are actually damaged and/or worn out to be less than 1 in 100. Ones that are a bit rough but still usable are maybe 5 in 100.
Cup and cone BB from the 80s and very early 90s most certainly are going to be more problematic but once seal cartridge bearing bottom brackets came along, the problems with them are few and very far between.
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#31
You can't argue with anecdotes. XT BBs used to last about a year on my mtb when I rode in all conditions. Now I tend to avoid the worst of the wet/muddy conditions and the bearings last far longer. Same goes for sealed suspension bearings. Now they run smoothly for years without maintenance.
#32
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Again, where are the real Scientists? Buy fifteen bikes, blast five right on the bearings with a pressure washer, ride five through sandy streams, and wash five with damp rags. Ride each 20K miles. measure wear with the most precise means possible after all that ....
Then we can have 15 anecdotes.
Then we can have 15 anecdotes.
#33
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You can't argue with anecdotes. XT BBs used to last about a year on my mtb when I rode in all conditions. Now I tend to avoid the worst of the wet/muddy conditions and the bearings last far longer. Same goes for sealed suspension bearings. Now they run smoothly for years without maintenance.
On my own bikes, I ride them in all conditions up to and including snow/slush. I have yet to wear one out in nearly 30 years of use of this kind of bottom bracket.
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Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
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Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
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#34
I suppose you can’t. However, I’ll point out again that I work at a co-op where we see the worst bikes that are still moving. Worn out or damaged bottom brackets are a very rear occurrence. That’s thousands of cartridge bottom brackets of every possible flavor.
On my own bikes, I ride them in all conditions up to and including snow/slush. I have yet to wear one out in nearly 30 years of use of this kind of bottom bracket.
On my own bikes, I ride them in all conditions up to and including snow/slush. I have yet to wear one out in nearly 30 years of use of this kind of bottom bracket.
#35
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Your bottom brackets sound truly the opposite of bomb-proof.
Just out of curiosity, how many XT bottom brackets did you go through? One? Fifty? One of mine has 25,000 miles on it and is still going strong. I’d really like to know what you are doing wrong so I can get another 25,000 out of mine.
Just out of curiosity, how many XT bottom brackets did you go through? One? Fifty? One of mine has 25,000 miles on it and is still going strong. I’d really like to know what you are doing wrong so I can get another 25,000 out of mine.
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Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
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Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
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Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
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Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
#36
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Again, where are the real Scientists? Buy fifteen bikes, blast five right on the bearings with a pressure washer, ride five through sandy streams, and wash five with damp rags. Ride each 20K miles. measure wear with the most precise means possible after all that ....
Then we can have 15 anecdotes.
Then we can have 15 anecdotes.
#37
Your bottom brackets sound truly the opposite of bomb-proof.
Just out of curiosity, how many XT bottom brackets did you go through? One? Fifty? One of mine has 25,000 miles on it and is still going strong. I’d really like to know what you are doing wrong so I can get another 25,000 out of mine.
Just out of curiosity, how many XT bottom brackets did you go through? One? Fifty? One of mine has 25,000 miles on it and is still going strong. I’d really like to know what you are doing wrong so I can get another 25,000 out of mine.
The same goes for sealed cartridge suspension bearings. Those typically only lasted one season too. Seals were not that amazing and these were top quality SKF.
Of course I could have carried on riding with crunchy BB and suspension bearings like many people routinely do. It’s not like they seized up or anything.
So anyway about your 25k mile BB. Have you ever opened it up and checked the grease and wear? Is it still super smooth running without a hint of creaking? What sort of a beating has it actually taken on the trails? I know you are going to tell me it’s like new.
#38
Senior Member
I've had Trek pressed fit BB last 3 maybe 4,000 miles and another bike has a Phil that is 40 years and many, many tens of thousands of miles
Too many variables. Type of seals. Rider loads. Environmental conditions. Maintenance. Bearing quality. Crappy shell mold. Etc. NTN LLB and Ceramic Speed are getting most of my N = 1 anecdotal use and both are smooth as a baby's butt although I only ride 7-9,000 miles per year since 2020. I don't even keep 6806 bearing in "stock" because they do last but wheel bearings? They wear faster whether load or water, I don't know.
Too many variables. Type of seals. Rider loads. Environmental conditions. Maintenance. Bearing quality. Crappy shell mold. Etc. NTN LLB and Ceramic Speed are getting most of my N = 1 anecdotal use and both are smooth as a baby's butt although I only ride 7-9,000 miles per year since 2020. I don't even keep 6806 bearing in "stock" because they do last but wheel bearings? They wear faster whether load or water, I don't know.
#39
Full Member
Cartridge bearing and not 100% water proof and neither is the rest of a bike. Fortunately, it is very easy to pop the seals out of a sealed cartridge bearing, wash wash the bearing out, repack them with grease, pop the seals back in and get more miles out of them
#40
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The whole idea behind cartridge bearings is to avoid having to repack them. That's why most people choose them so that they don't have to mess around maintaining them. If a cartridge bearing wears out you just replace the whole unit.
#41
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Again, where are the real Scientists? Buy fifteen bikes, blast five right on the bearings with a pressure washer, ride five through sandy streams, and wash five with damp rags. Ride each 20K miles. measure wear with the most precise means possible after all that ....
Then we can have 15 anecdotes.
Then we can have 15 anecdotes.
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Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
#42
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I have had to replace a few hub bearings…maybe 5 or 6. Only 2 of those were actually on hubs that I used and the rest were on hubs that I bought at a swap meet for cheap because the bearings were seized. I changed those out and the hub is currently in use. That’s 5 or 6 bearing replacement out of perhaps 30 sets of wheels. It just not as much of a problem as a lot of people make it out to be.
I will grant that I don’t power wash my bikes daily nor weekly nor even monthly. I use products that don’t require a lot of constant cleaning. A bit of dirt, dust, or cow crap on the bike doesn’t need to be washed off every time it gets on the bike. But I’m also not worried that the bearings are made of sugar and can’t stand an occasional trip to the car wash.
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Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
#43
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I have no clue about any of this .... and like yourself and most everybody else, I will do what I feel comfortable doing based on my own experience. I don't doubt [MENTION=21724]cyccommute[/MENTION], nor do I doubt 't [MENTION=539125]PeteHski[/MENTION] and each has such different experiences .... It might come down to personal situations which might or might not apply to anyone else.
For myself I will wash my bike with a garden hose and adjustable nozzle, and I will try not to aim at any bearings directly even with that low-pressure stream ... just because I have no real clue about my specific situation, and because I can wash my be excellently without aiming right at the bearing housings. I have not worn out a BB since the cottered crank days, but back when I used to commute on old-school and very cheap bikes I ate them up regularly. I have heard that HollowTech I was water-soluble (so to speak but never had an issue with HollowTech II .... and really don't care. What I have been doing seems to be working .... and besides, my whole fleet is about to crumble to dust because I wash them with Simple Green.
For myself I will wash my bike with a garden hose and adjustable nozzle, and I will try not to aim at any bearings directly even with that low-pressure stream ... just because I have no real clue about my specific situation, and because I can wash my be excellently without aiming right at the bearing housings. I have not worn out a BB since the cottered crank days, but back when I used to commute on old-school and very cheap bikes I ate them up regularly. I have heard that HollowTech I was water-soluble (so to speak but never had an issue with HollowTech II .... and really don't care. What I have been doing seems to be working .... and besides, my whole fleet is about to crumble to dust because I wash them with Simple Green.
#44
Senior Member
Why ask after using a power washer?
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#45
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I don't power wash but one time I thought why not dry the bike with a lawn blower. After I did that the freewheel wouldn't ratchet. Must have blown a speck of dirt into it. Replaced the freewheel and after a period of time it started working again, now I have a backup.
#48
I will grant that I don’t power wash my bikes daily nor weekly nor even monthly. I use products that don’t require a lot of constant cleaning. A bit of dirt, dust, or cow crap on the bike doesn’t need to be washed off every time it gets on the bike. But I’m also not worried that the bearings are made of sugar and can’t stand an occasional trip to the car wash.
We seem to have differing experiences with the effectiveness of sealed bearings to prevent water and crap ingress in all conditions and pressure washing. I wonder what I was doing wrong? Maybe XT BBs circa 2005 were just rubbish? I don’t see these problems today, but my bikes have a much easier life.
Out of interest I Googled to see how my fellow Brit mountain bikers get on with XT BBs on the trails and it seems they are much more in line with my experiences than yours ie doing well if you get more than a season before they die due to water/crap ingress:-
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/shimano-hollow-tech-2-bottom-bracket-how-long-does-yours-last/
Last edited by PeteHski; 09-07-23 at 05:11 AM.
#49
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We seem to have differing experiences with the effectiveness of sealed bearings to prevent water and crap ingress in all conditions and pressure washing. I wonder what I was doing wrong? Maybe XT BBs circa 2005 were just rubbish? I don’t see these problems today, but my bikes have a much easier life.
Out of interest I Googled to see how my fellow Brit mountain bikers get on with XT BBs on the trails and it seems they are much more in line with my experiences than yours ie doing well if you get more than a season before they die due to water/crap ingress:-
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/t...es-yours-last/
Out of interest I Googled to see how my fellow Brit mountain bikers get on with XT BBs on the trails and it seems they are much more in line with my experiences than yours ie doing well if you get more than a season before they die due to water/crap ingress:-
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/t...es-yours-last/
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Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
#50
Senior Member
Go watch the GCN video. They do the hard work of demonstrating that power washers don’t harm bearings. If that isn’t enough, here’s something from NSK bearings. The tests they did are 2 hours in length using water jets of close to 1600 psi. Granted there are differences between bearings but NSK who makes the bearings seem to feel they aren’t delicate.
I recall all the hullabaloo early external bearings. I also recall the same hullabaloo about ISIS bearings. Again, I have not had any bearings that I personally own fail. I see very few failures even with handling dozens to hundreds of used sealed bottom brackets of all flavors at my co-op.
I recall all the hullabaloo early external bearings. I also recall the same hullabaloo about ISIS bearings. Again, I have not had any bearings that I personally own fail. I see very few failures even with handling dozens to hundreds of used sealed bottom brackets of all flavors at my co-op.