joeya28

I wasnt really speaking to your charcter just that one post, but I guess we were referring to different postings. From the posting you just referred to I cant really argue with you.

umd

... deleted ...

gsteinb

I don't really believe that, so please disassociate me from it.

gsteinb

fair enough

umd

ok. I didn't mean that you are being elitist, because I don't believe that is true. The point that I was trying to make was that your performance speaks for itself.

joeya28

I'm originally from Orange County, I'm a student @ Baruch College in NYC so during the academic year I'm on the upper east side. I'd love to meet up in September and take a ride! I see you play golf. where do you play?

gsteinb

aww shucks

Phantoj

Yes, but "we" end up having to support healthy people who live to be 100, too. (Medicare, Social Security). In fact, I think society is money ahead when a smoker dies relatively young. (Not that early death is a good thing.)

CPFITNESS

I play at pelham/split rock in pelham bay park. UES has Cigar Inn on 71st and 1st and they have a newer place that is 3 times the size and a full scale hangout with multiple flat screens down on 53rd and 2nd. I also order my smokes online from Cigars international which is located in PA so they get here quick and stay nice and fresh. I run hot and cold with my smoking. When I buy online I typically buy about 50 smokes and then I definately have a couple a week sometimes more because of how much golf I play.

All this talk, I'm gonna jump on my bike and go get a smoke before work! (and for the do gooders work is teaching a bootcamp class in central park, I guess a cigar while I bark out instructions works just fine!

roadiejorge 

I always thought it was a standard hygienic practice not a habit comparable to smoking.


Minimizing the things people voluntarily consume to avoid the risk of cancer is considered being on a high horse?

Now that isn't a very compelling argument, that being the case let me eat a few Big Macs and snort some blow.

Moderation is key in the things we enjoy but our desires should always be measured against their effects against our long term health, especially habits since they can continually affect our health.

CPFITNESS

Obviously not all of the anti smokers were on a high horse but some people were coming off acting as if this is a guy talking about a full blown crack habit and it's just not so. people who sit by a campfire also inhale smoke, are we telling them not to do that? Some of the responses here were pretty wild.

I can also name numerous athletes in various sports that have engaged in some very unhealthy behavior and still held elite status in their sport so the performance argument isn't necessarily the stronges argument against smoking.

My point is that there are 168 hours in a week and this guy is spending 45 minutes a week smoking a cigar. there are worse things he could be doing.

powers2b

Didn't Phelps get caught on camera smoking the weeeeed?
I think he's probably still in pretty good shape.
Cigars are legal, last time I checked (for the record I think weed should be for medicinal use).
I am a highly educated adult capable of making my own life choices, last time I checked.
I ride a bike more than anyone I know personally, last time I checked.
I enjoy an occasional cigar, drink, and the company of a kind woman, last time I checked.
Maybe tonight I'll ride to my fav bar, have a drink and a cigar on the patio and strike up a conversation with a nice lady just to be sure.
But what I won't to tonight is stand on the corner wearing a "thou shalt not" sign and point to everyone and scream like a scene out of 'The Body Snatchers'

Enjoy

gsteinb

And again, the responses that got the kind of reactions you're talking of were the ones that said things like "you're not pro so you should enjoy a smoke now and then." I don't really care what any of you do. But don't post in an athletic forum and expect folks to agree it's not a health risk, and don't posit people in a cycling forum as having a stick up their ass because they don't smoke once in a while. As far as there being 'worst things one could do with their time" I can't seem to follow the logic in here so I can't guess what's on that list and can only say I'm able to avoid more than one vice simultaneously while enjoying the living crap out of my life, family, dog and winning a lot of races along the way. There may be more to life than cycling but each one of those things on my list is made better by not smoking.

CPFITNESS

Try the unkind ones, they are even better!

CPFITNESS

i understand that this is an athletic forum but his question was along the lines of "just how bad is 3 cigars a month for the cardiovascular system" and quite frankly, its not that bad and its not going to decrease performance in my experience. I smoke cigars and started cycling in february and my cycling continues to get better and better and for the record I'm a personal trainer so it's not like I wasn't in good shape already when I started cycling. The only real respectable answer from the anti smoking gurus in this thread was the gentleman who said in his personal experience his pipe smoking had detracted from his training.

BillyD

I smoked for forty-three years. Yes, 43. Hell, I used to smoke while cycling (those ashes blowing in my eyes were annoying as the dickens).

Quit 5 years ago and like an earlier poster said, getting that monkey off my back was one of my greatest achievements in life.

Nonetheless, when my cousin comes over 2 or 3 times a year and offers me a cigar, I light up with him. That ain't gonna kill me. It's called moderation.

botto 

i can't believe this clusterfcuk of a thread is still going on. good job.

BillyD

Fixed that for ya.

Might be my new signature.

gsteinb

I'm still not particularly clear on how that's relevant to a working knowledge of cycling or general health and fitness. I can promise you also that not too many smokers are winning amateur races.

umd

Just to cloud the waters, I saw a collegiate rider in the 3s a few years ago light up a cigarette, take some puffs, then put it out on his top tube. He proceeded to nearly lap the field before dropping back to help his teammate. He didn't really smoke, it was just an intimidation tactic.

botto 

ok Billy, time to stop defending your questionable patch of grass, and be professional.

shut down this POS thread. thanks.

halfspeed

It's a prop and a ritual.

RJM

Yep. Lets not forget to some its a show of rebellion or of adulthood.

Really, I just see it as something to do with your hands when you can't think of anything else to do with them. My father smokes cigars and when I used to sit with him on the porch talking to him he would offer me one and I would accept. I don't smoke them anymore because I really gained no value from the cigar. When I hang with him now I have a glass of water, coffee or beer in my hands.

BillyD

Wut?? The majority discussion is about the detrimental effects of smoking, even occasional smoking, on one's biking performance. How much more OT (ON-Topic) can you get??

You know me, I only shut down the rowdy and off-topic threads. This is neither.

umd

All lame reasons IMO.

I remain unconvinced.


And that's the heart of my question. What value is there in smoking other than the delivery of an addictive, mind-altering drug?

Edit: not that there is necessarily anything wrong with addictive mind-altering drugs, as long as we recognize it for what it is.