twobadfish

For real though if you watched that Vimeo video and still aren't interested you're crazy.

mechBgon

Where it would be best of all, is mountain bikes. I haven't the faintest doubt that there's an XTR Di2 group being toyed with in Shimano's skunkworks.

nismo604

A little over kill for my needs, but given the choice between mech and electronic shifting money no object, sign me up for the Di2 please. The thing looks awesome, definitely a luxury but a welcome one. Weird seeing the resistance to this, take the cost out of the equation I'm sure the tune will change immensely.

bt93

I think it's neat, but for commuting? As I said before, we're sure to see electronic shift for commuters now that the group is winning. But cable systems aren't complicated and I might spend a half hour a year (probably less) adjusting my set up, and it's a cheap SRAM X 4 with grip shift. If anything electronic shifting might bring more people into the fold of commuting, and that's a good thing. I just hate seeing bikes getting more like engineless motorcycles. Hydraulic systems for brakes and now batteries for shifting. Hopefully when electric shifting gets to commuters, they'll run off dynamo hubs which are powerful enough for the shifting and lights. An on board microwave oven and 100 watt stereo would be nice too, just go slow up the hills.

JohnJ80

I would imagine that very soon we will see battery requirements dropping and batteries maybe being incorporated into frames (but changeable). It'll be like you do with your computer, change the battery once a year.

I also think we might see wireless at some point but not until we see this technology propagating into lower groups. From a manufacturer perspective (and LBS), if you can have some intelligence in the bike so that you decrease the need for tuneups and get rid or diminish that 30 day tuneup on a new bike, that would have a big impact for LBS costs. No rubbing FDs for those who don't understand shifting (new and casual riders) would be a big benefit.

i don't think there is anyway that this doesn't spread relatively quickly. As Shimano starts to sell more, the cost of the every single one of the electronic or electromechanical components will drop quickly with volume.

J.

Mithrandir

Don't have it, interested, but price point and added complexity of components currently aren't worth it.

Here's what would convert it from "cool toy" to "essential" for me:

1) condense the shifter into one up/down shift control, which automatically chooses which chainring/cog combination is appropriate given my "up" or "down" shift command (ie: program the computer to know exactly how to order every single one of the 21 gears on my bike; excluding the extreme's where the chain angle is too high of course)
2) let me put 2 of these shifters on my bike; one on the handlebars, one on the bar ends. I love cruising on the bar ends, but moving my hands down the the bars is a pain.


If they do this, at a reasonable price point, I would buy it in an instant. I spend so much time in gear 2-7 when I could probably move up to 3-4, but avoid doing that because I know there's a hill coming soon and I'll just have to switch from 3 to 2 again on the chainring.

twobadfish

You guys saw where it eliminates cross-chaining by adjusting the FD when shifting the RD right? Friggin awesome!

My biggest concern is durability and water resistance. Other than that, there are nothing but benefits from this. I have a $500 GPS/computer setup and I'm not even in the slightest worried about bikes becoming "engineless" as well... I'm the engine.

Mithrandir

Think about it... ANT+ compatibility, pair it with a power meter. Program the bike for an optimal "power per crank rotation", and the bike could automatically change gears the second you're applying too much or too little power.

For those who say that would take the challenge out of cycling... well you could program it for a power level higher than normal, so that the bike forces you to pedal harder!

Probably a lot of details to work out, but that sounds cool. Really damn cool.

twobadfish

You just blew my mind.

JohnJ80

Interesting idea. You could have a button or control that was easily tapped with a finger (think Flight Deck) that would allow you to increment that power level up or down as required or to take full control over the shifting similar to what many car automatic transmissions allow you to do now - click it over into a quasi manual mode (i.e. no clutch) and shift through the gears manually.

That would be really cool and probably useful. You could set up your power level as you start. Depending on how you feel, conditions, need for recovery in part of the ride, etc.. you could increment the power set point up or down as needed.

I don't see any reason that this isn't eminently doable technically with some (small) additional electronics in the shifter circuitry and something like an iPhone app.

You know, this is going to blow the "friction-shifters-are-still-the-best" and the "we-don't-need-no-stinking-electronics-because-they-aren't-pure-enough" crowd's minds.

J.

JimF22003

Not so far. Completely trouble-free.

Shifting is perfect every time, under load, front/rear/both at the same time. Seriously this is very nice. Expensive but nice.

It takes about an hour to charge. I've done it twice in about 1300 miles. Neither time was the battery anywhere close to being exhausted.

I spend way more time in the drops now, since it's so easy to upshift or downshift from that position. I don't try to judge which would be the "best" gear to use when hitting a riser or rolling hill. I hit it in the best gear at the bottom, and just shift as needed. You can certainly do this without electronic shifting, but at the very least you need to soft-pedal a bit to avoid dropped chains or whatever. Being able to shift the FD while standing on the pedals up a hill, is really, really nice.

To people who say, "you don't need electronic shifting to do that -- I can do that with manual shifting" I say: You're right. I agree. You get no argument from me. Don't hit me please!

idc

I'd consider it but only once it gets a LOT cheaper.

JimF22003

I can't speak to durability yet, at about 1300 miles. But I've been caught out in three epic thunderstorms so far. I mean serious downpoars. So far so good.

mikepwagner

The interference issue has been solved for heart monitors and almost every other digital wireless device you own - bluetooth headsets, etc.

We aren't talking about RC model airplanes in the 60s.

The hacking is a more interesting issue - the levels of encryption/pairing used for these kinds of devices are meant for convenience, nit security.

Mike

KonAaron Snake 

I wish you were in Philly so I could ask to borrow your bike! I have to get one of these systems, but I'll probably have to wait a few years.

JohnJ80

You could, for example, just blanket a crucial portion of a race course with a transmitter at the same frequency (could be handheld) that would swamp the receivers on bikes with such a terrible signal to noise problem that the bikes wouldn't shift until out of the field. That would give a big advantage to anyone wired or mechanical. So you don't need to "hack" anything, you just swamp it out. No amount of encryption or anything will overcome that sort of problem. That would also imply that even near field RF transmitters that might be on the side of race course could be an issue even without nefarious intents in mind.

This is an issue in other sports too. For example, in alpine ski racing, I believe FIS (international authority) will not permit wireless timing systems on most courses (that may have changed in the last year or so). It's about reliability and no matter what you do, a wired signal will always be more reliable than a wireless one.


J.

FunkyStickman

Not interested. Seriously. I will never live in a world where money is no object. I have 7sp indexed downtube shifters on my bike, I like them just fine. They cost $15. No, I don't expect people to "get it"... nor do I care. Sorry.

(edit) Went back and watched the video again, and I couldn't stop laughing at how much marketing-ese they threw in there. It was sickening. I especially LOL'ed at how the reviewer said they built "a lot" of bikes, but were "always at the feet of our mechanical guru begging for a quick derailer adjustment..." Dude, seriously? Maybe they should just take up knitting.

Maybe I'm just a DIY kinda guy, but I don't see the need for this at all... it is strictly want. I don't want it.

JohnJ80

Don't worry. No one cares if you get it or not.

J.

twobadfish

It sounds like you come from a different breed than roadies and/or techies. But either way, whether or not money is the object shouldn't change your interest in them. It's like saying you aren't interested in a flying car because you can't afford it. Who cares, it's a friggin flying car!

HardyWeinberg

Well, I played w/ a duraace di2 setup the other day, and I have to say that under showroom conditions and a gorgeous day it was just amazing. If you are not pedaling, it will not shift. If you are pedaling, when you hit the button, it will shift. Very cool.

I can't imagine preferring Di2 over an IGH. You could get 2 rohloffs for the price.

FunkyStickman

You're catching on...

That's very true, I'm surrounded by technology everywhere else in my life, and my bike is one of the places I can go to get away from it. The simpler, the better.

I used to think that way, 20 years ago. Nowdays I realize how much of that is wasted effort... 99% of Ferraris are never taken to a track and driven like they were designed to be. It's just a waste. I'd rather have fun with what I have now.

twobadfish

Nothing wrong with that

chipcom 

and that is relevant to us riding our bikes to work how?

no interest at all from me, yet. Perhaps when/if electronic shifters become standard equipment and cost effective I might consider it for my commuting purposes...I figure around 2015 or so, maybe.

twobadfish

I really, really, like the idea of automatic shifting - especially while commuting. Set power output to 175 watts and have the system take care of it anytime I'm over 90rpm on my cadence.

I can't stop thinking about the possibilities.

MNBikeguy