pgoat

I am looking at a 97 Lemond Zurich - new tires, all 600/ultegra.



Frame looks okay in pics, but my issues - I am assuming this is 8 speed, original STI shifters (which may be suspect at this age, no?)...and quill stem/threaded headset, but is it 1" ?

Please note I'm in a super trendy part of NYC, so prices will probably highest in the US here...but guy wants $550 OBO.

pgoat

btw, if I understand the rules here, 1997 is the cutoff point - so this one is okay to post, I hope.

FastJake

1997 LeMond Zurich - BikePedia

Condition looks nice but needing an overhaul. Cables look old and rusty. Still, for Reynolds 853 + 600 STI I'd say that's a pretty good deal in NYC. If everything works, go for it.

pgoat

my old 1986 Trek 500 commuter is currently busted, so while I fix it I was looking for a backup commuter...I know this is a racier bike, but I like that (ride quick, with a backpack, no fenders or racks here).

I found a 1988 Trek 330, DT shift indexed 6 speed with True temper cro-mo main tubes...$400....they'd take $350. Am I right in saying the Zurich is a way better deal (given overall quality, plus liking a more aggressive geometry), even at another $100-200?

miamijim

stem and headset will be 1"

bikes of that vintage I usually say 25% of MSRP...but there're exceptions...

25% of $1800 is $450.

I dont think the asking price is too far off if everything works....check everything. Make sure the stem and seat ost aren't stuck, make sure the STI levers work ok. How are the tires?

Offer $475 and go from there....

"trendy doesn't mean it valuable" - Rick Harrison
"It's Lance armstrong's bike"- Chumlee
"dude, I'll give you like 200 bukcks for it." - Corey
"Son, I'm in at $250 and not a penny more." - The old man

pgoat

he says tires are new gatorskins

McBTC

My '01 Lemond BA had a conventional quill stem so they stuck with that for a while -- 1"

zukahn1 

I would say $450 or so price in value considering the the somewhat dirty worn look of the bike. Yet with the new tires the asking isn't out of line for NYC if everything works good. These were some of the nicest performing steel bikes ever made and are somewhat underated overlooked by buyers. You would likely have to spend over $1000 in your market to find something nicer as rider.

pgoat

Thanks all.

I'm feeling better about $450 for the reasons mentioned - could need new cables, etc.

I'm a bit leery of 1" headsets & forks also...I do like old steel but hate obsolete parts when if/when it comes to replacing things.

Still, I can only go so new/recent when locking up on the street...

FastJake

The Lemond is a much better buy than the Trek you posted, taking the price differences into account.

$450 would be a great price for that bike in NYC in my opinion. Do not be leery of 1". Stems, forks, and headsets are still widely available. Remember, most road bikes didn't switch to 1 1/8" until the late 1990s or early 2000s.

However, I would not lock that Lemond up on the street. I would find something much uglier/cheaper if this is to be a regular commuter. I wouldn't want STI or 23mm tires on a commuter but I commute every day, year round, so I am the rack and fender type.

miamijim

+1 to that. Plenty of options out there. Stronglight just re-issued the A9...

McBTC

Nitto stems are great for these bikes. Lemond has a CF fork, right? my old BA and Zurich both had carbon fiber forks with quill stems...

pgoat

yes, this one had a carbon fork

Thank you so much everyone, this feedback was very helpful. I went to see it and was very impressed with the bike overall...and you're right, Fast Jake - after seeing it in person, there's no way I'd leave it on the street here. Or anywhere, really... at least, not 9-5 M-f, where thieves know they have a safe 8 hour shift to go to town on it.

In the end I passed, as much as I really liked the bike. The seller went as low as $425 for me (I offered $400) because the shifters were not working well. They looked really grimy and the gear cables were shot, so there is a good chance the rear changer could have been resurrected with copious solvent flushing and new cable. But the front shifter was toast...I got it onto the big ring and then it was all loose and slack, no click at all on the small lever to drop back down.

I realize $425 may have still been an okay price - the frame, bars, headset, fork, seat and post, all seemed fine. I actually have some new high end 10 speed shifters, chains and cassettes in reserve for my nicer bikes, so I guess I could have thrown some of them on it, but after that my outlay (including having a shop doing cable installation and set up, not my forte...I can install the rest) would have been closer to $800-900. On top of that, I'm guessing the hubs would have needed repacking and the rear wheel was kinda messed up....chain rings were beginning to approach shark tooth profile as well. So, although it was a complete bike, I almost felt like I was buying a frameset start point for a new build, which seemed too steep at $425 to me.

I hope I didn't let a good one go. But I've seen these sell on le bay in nicer condition, with upgraded drive trains, for around $600 - so my sense was, better to keep looking. I will say I liked the feel (my first ride on 853) and it drove home I really belong on a 49cm, instead of the teeny 48s I own (50cm frames are too big for me). Finally, I'm really glad I saw how much nicer this was vs. a Trek 300 series...and I MUCH prefer the Lemond, though the latter might be a better street lockup candidate...just not at $350-400! So a good learning experience, at least.

Thanks again for the BF C&V support!

pgoat

this is good to know, thanks. I went through the experience years ago of selling off a lot of quill stems, etc. only to get an 80s bike again around 2005 and find availability of that stuff had suddenly dried up. My guess is the fixie craze may have helped revive interest in 1" threaded stuff, as well as current high end traditional lugged steel builders.

pgoat

almost everyone I know feels that way; I looked at the Trek 330 for commuting, b/c the DT shifts would be less attractive to thieves and also b/c it came with 28mm tires and wider rims. But I commuted on a mtb for years and i think i just wanted a change...now I feel liberated being on a road bike. I use 23s or even 22mm tires to commute, rotated down from my nicer bikes at about their half-lifespan, and just try to be careful with potholes.

FastJake

FWIW, there is a huge difference between a MTB and a road bike with wide tires and fenders. I made myself a winter MTB in addition to my regular road (fixed gear) commuter for the winter and I hated it. Soooo slow feeling, even though it actually weighed less. A road racing bike with 23mm tires will obviously be faster but the difference is not as painful IMO.

pgoat

True. I primarily switched from the mtb because I developed a hand issue which made flat bars untenable for me, but was pleasantly surprised to find the shorter wheelbase a huge advantage in weaving through tight traffic spots. Somehow I thought the MTb would be ideal for that (it was an old rigid cross country bike). But I always ran 28mm slicks on that bike as well. I liked the flat & pothole protection with knobbies but not much else. Even got some Nokian studded tires, which were amazing in the winter, but the weight was utterly offensive to me.

My old Trek can accomodate 28s, so one day I might try them. So far I've been okay with 23s.

pgoat

btw, I confess, I am curious - was $425 a price i should have accepted, given highly questionable 8 speed STI shifters, cables shot, rear wheel in need of truing (it was also angled funny, tire almost hitting one chainstay, although that may have merely been a sloppy QR fix), chain rings on their way out, and what looked to be a general o/h clean and lube required?

I realize it wouldn't have been MUCH cheaper, but I would have felt more comfortable paying in the $350 range...I realize this is a highly personal thing (i/e/ 'what is the bike worth to you?') but I am wondering what others here feel, since I am not as knowledgeable about C&V bikes. Again, I have spare parts laying around which i could have slapped on myself to upgrade and modernize the bike, but that would have totaled a solid $750ish outlay for me, if I purchased and put Sora 9 speed on it... more like $950-1000 if i used the Dura Ace & Ultegra 10 spd stuff I'm stockpiling.

I love a restoration/upgrade project as much as anyone, but if I am starting with a project bike, I personally like to spend lower - especially since you don't know what surprises might be found along the process. I'd be just as happy finding a minty fresh 90s Lemond that's already had nicer wheels and drivetrain added, and paying for the finished project.

zukahn1 

Considering the condition issues $350-400 is about all it would be worth and I would say pass at that price unless you had the tools, experience and parts needed to sort most of the stuff out your self. Figure $100 fora set of STI's, $30 for new cabling and bartape and $50 for a new chain and cassette so you would be close to $200 not counting time labor to sort things out and that is if there are no surprises. If everything was good on the bike fully serviced and ready to ride it would be a $600-700 bike but you could easily surpass that by the time you got done.

pgoat

Thanks - yes, that was exactly my thinking - and by $100 for set of STIs, I assume you meant used - which i am pretty scared of (buying a used shifter on le bay, for instance).

A while back, I replaced the right 9 speed Dura Ace 7700 shifter on my ca. 2002 Orbea (it just suddenly stopped upshifting, unless you used two hands to steady it) with a new Sora - the only level I could find new - and that ran me $90ish plus another 90 or so to have a shop install it. I now have a couple of nicer 10 speed shifters salted away, but in the Zurich's case, that's adding a $200-300 part to a bike that also will need all the other stuff.

I could do a lot of the other work myself - BB, cassette swap, headset...but still, it's a sufficient amount of work that I'd want the initial price to be lower. If everything was working on this one, I'd have gone to $500, as per the recommendations above and just invested a bit extra for a tune up/clean up.

I guess part of the subjective process with an old bike is how emotionally involved you get over a nice old frame. This one did seem fine there, and I used to lust after Lemonds of this era when i couldn't afford a new one, so of course I was wrestling with the decision...the ability to walk away from a deal that's not right for you is obviously a good requirement when buying vintage bikes. Luckily in this case, I listened to my gut...or head; not sure which controls my bank account...

FastJake

I think the bike looked a lot nicer in pictures than in person. My estimates were assuming that everything was working but basic stuff was needed like cables/housing/bar tape/chain/cassette/etc. Once you add broken STI and a screwed up rear wheel that really changes things. I think you were right to walk away. The bike sounded trashed.

pgoat

Thanks Jake.

RoadGuy

OP, if you're going to use the bike as a commuter, I'd look for something more pedestrian to throw the thieves off.

A Trek 300 Series bike would be just the ticket, but the one up by you is selling for way too much money.

This past couple of weeks a number of Trek 300s and 330s (at least 5-6) have popped up on the local CLs priced between $100-$175. There are a couple that I think I could get for about $75, or so. Some need parts, and a little TLC, and some don't. To me, a bike needing TLC is preferable to a garage queen, because I like to install an assortment of parts that I prefer on my bikes, rather pay a premium and get someone's else's ideal bike. Shipping a bike frame without the wheels is a lot cheaper than shipping with wheels. At the prices for the same bike where you live, you could buy one of those bikes, have it shipped without the wheels, and replace them when you freshen the bike.

I just received a 94 Trek 1400 that I bought off eBay with frame, fork, headset, bottom bracket, seatpost, seat, and handlebar stem. The handlebar that was supposed to be included was missing, and the non-detachable derailleur hanger got bent in shipping, so the Seller lowered my price to $65 shipped. Now I can build it up my way. I just need to decide which way to go on the shifters (downtube or brifters?).

pgoat

I like your thinking, RoadGuy.

I agree, for a commuter, the 300 or even 400 series is great. I do see a lot of them on the street. And I'd rather get a bruised one, so I won't cry when I begin bashing my lock into it. Admittedly, that 330 above does look to be in very nice condition in the photos, and i imagine it will sell at close to that price b/c folks here can and do blow crazy money on bikes. If they can part with $400ish for that and they enjoy it, fine by me.

As for the Lemond, I guess I was picturing the Zurich as more of the lower end Lemonds I've seen...once I saw it in person, I realized A. it was in rougher shape than I expected and B. yes, it's way too nice to lock up.

Finally, I agree 100% about customizing a beater ride (I call it Frankenbiking, as well). I am hoping to resurrect my busted Trek 500 (broken dropout) soon and will post pics of the repair in a dedicated thread for that. That's a 531 main frame and was fairly pristine when i found it ten years ago - paid $200, which I thought was very fair in 2005 NYC. I think old Treks were more under the radar then.

Here's with minor mods I made very soon after purchase, a wider bar and cane creek aero brake levers:




I used it as is with 12 speed DT shifters for a few years... then went to a flat bar for occasional commutes,



and then grafted a 9-speed rapid fire mtb shifter and wide range SRAM cassette on it so I could do long club rides with big climbs (low was 39x32).





Last year I sold my commuter mtb and demoted the Trek to daily duty - put a drop bar with threadless converter on it and managed to find a way to get that mtb shifter on there...it works pretty dang well, if I do say so myself (who says you'll never have a use for old parts missing their mates?)

pgoat

and i like that idea of buying remote and shipping light - thanks, will explore that for sure.