Pmr85

Hi guys. So I took up the task in building a commuting/touring bicycle that can go off road (no heavy duty off road) so far I posted a thread a couple of days ago in regards to Group sets for my drive train I got great expert feed back and I would like to thank the people who helped me.

But now I need a more in depth analysis, and guide from all you experts out there. So far this is what I have acquired.

All items bought will show cost with taxes included. "Please Note" I am on a budget of $750 dollars usd.

Bike Frame: Surly Disc Truck 50cm supports 26" rims/wheels. ( she was professionally fitted to size by our LBS owner)= Not part of budget but it cost me $550.00



1. Drivetrain Components: SHIMANO Deore M610 MTB Groupset 10 speeds 170mm 7pcs
( 191817636365 ) $219.00
"Please Note" I live in a very hilly city 90% of my commute and my fiance commute is hills with some being quite steep. some of the road is either under construction or pot laden. Also chose this group set because we intend to go off the beaten path in some of our touring I guess you can say expeditionary touring.

2. Disc Brakes: A set of Avid BB7 MTB brakes, they include 2 160mm rotors and 2 BB7 mtb disc brakes, also included is the jagwire cex. I bought separately a pair of avid mtb linear brake levers meant for mechanical disk brakes. $125.00

3.Headset: Crane Creek 40 1 1/8 headset. $45.00

4.Handlebars: XLC Touring multi function bail HB-C05 $21.00

5. Seat post: Need recommendations.

6. Handlebar Stem: Need recomendations.

7. Wiring for shift levers: Need recommendations.

8. Rims and Hubs: Need recommendations. But I was thinking. Will any rear hub be ok to use with my cassette and rear derailleur? I was thinking of a 10 speed hub with 36h 6 bolts for disc brakes but I do not know what model to get exactly also rims I was thinking of Alex rims adventurers 26" 36H.

After this I have left on budget: $340.00

This is not by any means an expensive built. but I want something decent so we can get used to touring and later on without any budget constraint built some pretty good touring/expedition bicycles.
Hand
Am I missing any other crucial components? Fiance will be buying her own gear ie; racks panniers lights etc etc..
ALL INPUT IS GREATLY APPRECIATED!!!
Again guys thank you for your time and feedback!!!

robow

Easton EA 50 seatpost and Dimension stems, excellent value for the dollar.

VT_Speed_TR

An option - check Craigslist for a 5 -10 YO mtn bike with a 27 speed triple and 26 in wheels. Likely can pick one up for around $200. Transfer parts over to the LHT. done. Lots of money leftover for travel.

mdilthey

Good work. Your brakes, drivetrain, and headset are very smart choices.

For your wiring — The housing is the tube, and the cable is the wire. You can really use anything here, the generic stuff at your local bike shop is just as good when it comes to derailleurs. You don't get a benefit like Jagwire provides for brakes, if that makes sense. Jagwire is an awesome upgrade for mechanical disc brakes, but for derailleurs, the housing is always compressionless, so you can use any housing you want.

I would stick to stainless steel for your cables, though. I don't like the Teflon-coated cables that come with the Jagwire kit; the teflon can rub off and gunk up the housing. I just replace the Jagwire ones with stainless steel. My LBS will trade me all four of my cables for a 6-pack of beer.

I agree with the previous poster. Dimension stems and Easton stems are very good, and the EA50 seatpost is great. I also like Bontrager's stuff, their new stems are quite nice for the price with CNC machined faceplates.

Raiden

Will you be assembling the bike? Do you have all the tools you need already? Grease, antiseize, maybe some frame saver?

Your build is solid. Can't go wrong with most of what you've picked.

Do you have bar tape/grips? And have you actually tried those bars before? They're... interesting. I've used them and eventually just switched to a more normal straight MTB style bar.

Any 8/9/10 speed, disc compatible wheelset will work. I wouldn't sweat the difference between 32 and 36 holes for the amount of weight you'll be pushing. I highly suggest Shimano hubs for their steel freehubs (cassettes dont 'bite' into them like into most brands' aluminum freehubs). Rim choice? Eh, whatever.

Equally important are good tires. I suggest going with the most flat-resistant combination of stuff you can get. MSRP on a set of Specialized Armadillos or Continental tires (for instance) and extra thick tubes (don't forget rim strips, and possibly some sort of flat stopping goo) will be $150-200 but totally worth it.

MassiveD

Alex DH22 is excellent also if it happens to be availalbe. I can't think of any reason not to go 36, it's a freebie with 26" wheels to get essentially 40 spoke performance levels with standard components, why pass it up. Some say the 36 will be harder to find, but I am OK with: 1) less likely to ever need a replacement rim; 2) most likely to find a complete wheel, chance of getting parts in the boonies is low anyway.

I would go 8 speed if you can get NOS 8 speed hubs. Otherwise if you are stuck with hubs designed around the geometry of 10s or 11s might as well take advantage. Personally anything above 9 I don't want, but I use bar ends and the shifting like a squirrel on crack thing is pointless with that set-up.

What seat are you using?

veganbikes

For seat post Thomson makes a nice one and used ones can usually be found for $50 in decent condition

For stem Dimension makes cheap stuff that is pretty decent and in plenty of angles extreme and not so extreme. Though I gotta throw in a pitch for 3T I love their stuff and have both an old 80s quill stem and a more modern one and they are quite nice and light.

Cables and housing would most likely be Jagwire which can be found in file boxes at shops all over the country. If not them Yokozuna is a great choice.

If you want good rims, Velocity or WTB has some great options, I have WTB rims on two bikes and no complaints. They look nice and work great. If I didn't go with them I would have gone with Velocity.

For hubs I would love to say Phil Wood, Paul Comp. White Industries, Chris King or Hope but that would probably be out of the budget and on the Paul Hubs you wouldn't find a rear easily (since they cannot source the freehubs anymore) So instead I would say Deore XT hubs would be a great choice. If not those SRAM X7s are nice because they are sealed bearing but you wouldn't want to replace the QRs with an internal cam QR or better yet get some Pinheads, Pitlocks or at least Delta Axlerods for wheel security.

I would go with Sapim or Wheelsmith spokes and brass nipples but if your shop doesn't build wheels and you cannot find someone to do it (which isn't likely) QBP has a wheelhouse and they use DT Swiss which are perfectly fine though the company is a little JA about people building with their products.

elcruxio

For hubs
Shimano is a good budget choice for hubs. They're cup and cone which means that they don't have the sealing of a cartridge bearing hub, but are a bit easier to maintain and service (although the new XT hubs are pretty well sealed). The downside of cup and cone hubs is that the cones can be swapped, but cups usually cannot, so if the cup wears down too much or gets pitting, it will mean you'll need to swap the whole hub, which is a hassle.

A cartridge bearing hub is a carrier for the bearings, so the hub doesn't wear as such, especially if service is done with proper tools. When the cartridges wear you swap them and the hub will be as new.

Some good cartridge manufacturers are the IMO extremely overpriced options (Phil, Chris King, White), then there the as good quality but a lot cheaper (Hope, DT Swiss), then there are the Taiwan offerings which are actually really affordable and the higher end models apparently work very well (novatec) and of course there are some the really affordable options which may or may not be as nice, don't really know (halo spin doctor for example)
I'd go with Hope or Dt Swiss, although the DT swiss 540 Tandem model which is the only one they offer with 36 hole drilling is actually quite expensive, almost at the overpriced catergory. A Hope top end model (Pro 4) will cost about two thirds or less than the 540 Tandem and about less than half of a Chris King.

The front hub can be anything really. They don't see as much wear as rear hubs and have less components to go boom. So a Shimano XT or even a lower end model will do just fine. However if you want your hub to be serviceable into the far future, get a cartridge bearing model so your hub itself won't wear.

For a rear hub however I would not suggest a Shimano as in the recent years there has been an epidemic of cracked freehub shells especially in the XT and higher lines. For some reason this has been happening since 2010 or even earlier but Shimano hasn't done anything about it. While it's quite easy to swap a Shimano freehub, their warranty service is among the worst in the industry (ie. you'll essentially need to buy a new one as you won't be getting a warranty replacement, especially on the road) and you might not find one as a typical spare part from the location you're riding through. And a cracked freehub is severe enough to instantly stop you in your tracks.

saddlesores

i've been using the novatec hubs ever since my (inferior) aluminum frame cracked
and couldn't be repaired. my deore non-disc hubs that had seen 50k miles or so
migrated to other bikes.

novatek (also sold as joytek and relabeled as dozens of other brands) is decent
quality and lovely to look at with a rainbow of pretty colors. i've been using the DO41
front (2-bearing) and DO42 rear (4 bearing) 36-spoked for light touring (20-30 pounds)
on some very rough terrain.

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm...46701.2.qu3C78

only problem is the cartridge bearings. hubs sold here on the mainland come
with cheapass chinese junk, good for 1000km of touring at most. need to
switch to some quality taiwan cartidges. you probably won't have that problem.

bang the old set out, will need a bearing press (DIY threaded rod works) to install
new set.

you'll need to clean the pawls occasionally (let's say if you do a couple thousand
km in the mud during monsoon season), as they sometimes get gummed up.

and check that you get the steel body rather than the inferior aluminum that
can't quite handle the high torque of loaded mountain climbing.

Trevtassie

Avoid the shimano hubs that have a 12mm axle, they're ones that are having problems with the freehub. The axle takes up room the freehub should be using. The 10mm axle versions don't have this problem.
If you are going to be building wheels you may as well get a front dynamo hub. SP or Shimano are OK and cheap.
I built some wheels with the Alex Adventurers, they aren't super round but still build OK, they just take a bit longer to true than say a Mavic, but for $22 each, who's complaining! I used Sapim Strong spokes, overkill I think, hard to get enough tension on the non drive side to stop the nipples unscrewing, I used loctite in the end. If I did it again I'd use some thinner single butted spokes on the NDS.

robow

Do you happen to know which year and models might contain the 12mm axle?

veganbikes

So let's say that you have a Phil Hub for 20 years or more which I know some people have and you spend $500, that would be $25 a year for those 20 years which adds up to an Alivio hub per year. Not bad and since they are Phil hubs if you decide you don't want them after 10 years you will still have a decent chance of getting good money for it because people love Phil Wood. Sure they are initially expensive but considering they last quite a bit of time and they are always well loved and easy to sell, it isn't that much over time.

I won't disagree on Hope, they were in the running for my hubs on my new touring bike. They make a nice quality product from everything I have seen. Plus I dig they are made in their home country and really easy to service and replace bearings and such.

I hadn't heard or seen anything about cracked freehubs so I guess nobody in my area has that issue or they aren't coming by the shop? Though I won't doubt that these problems can't exist especially from larger manufacturing giants who cannot keep as good of a reign on QC and are going faster and lighter all the time not always for good reason.

fietsbob

Buying the built LHT and just changing a few parts saves Money, and you will have the stock parts to re sell and get some back ..

I like Figure 8 bend Trekking Bars and all your MTB drive train Parts will Fit.

stem ? Go to a Bike shop with an assortment and try several to determine the height and reach you need , In Person ..

& dont cut down the fork steerer until you have ridden the Bike for a Year and dialed in the fit by Riding..

Spacers are Cheap .. stacked above the stem work as well as below.

I have 2 stems.. lower one, Bar bag mount, Upper has the Handle Bars in It.

mstateglfr 

Paying $900-1000 for only the hubs is a tough obstacle to overcome for...most people. Thats $1100-1250 once the rims, spokes, and nips are added in. Talk about a barrier to entry. If someone can do that, more power to them. But dang thats a hefty cost to handle for much of the touring world.

Swapping out an Alivio hub a year?...I recently sold a bike with Alivio hubs which are 20 years old. Cleaned out with some new balls and grease- spun great. Granted they hadnt been ridden for 1K of miles each year for two decades. An Alivio hub should last at least 4 years/4000mi of road/gravel riding with periodic maintenance taking 30min every year or so.

veganbikes

I wasn't saying someone would swap a hub a year just that it would be equivalent to buying an Alivio hub a year. They should last a little longer than just one year.

They are expensive and you can find something cheaper that is still quite good but the whole idea of Phil is they last a long time, hold value well and are easily worked on. If you are building a set of wheels to last and last and last with little you need to do Phils are a good choice.

robow

Did you actually read the OP's allowable budget? Phil Wood hubs aren't doable nor are Hope hubs possible, unless he wants to ride standing up without a seatpost and saddle, using a wooden dowel rod for a handlebar. Deore/Tiagra hubs will last for years with just a little care and are more likely to fit his budget.

Trevtassie

One of these for the rear Shimano Deore Disc Hub Rear M525A | Chain Reaction Cycles 10mm axle, double seals on the bearings, swappable Freehub so you can run 7 speed, 8 speed, 9 , 10 whatever floats your boat with a little spacer fiddling.
For the front Shimano Hub Dynamo DH-T785 Centerlock 36 h black | Hub Dynamo Shop
Probably find the equivalent of either in centre lock or 6 bolt so you can rotate the discs after a while.
With Alex rims and Sapim spokes you'd have years of great service.
Then grab a cheap suspension seat post from wherever. 50mm of travel is nice because the 25mm ones are a bit stiff.
Plus a cheap stem, just needs to be at least 110mm play nice with Trekking bars. Otherwise they feel weird if the rear free ends are behind the steering axis. Make sure you angle them down at the front so you have to stretch out to reach the front position. The idea is to have different hand positions that change your body angle which changes which muscles you use. Most people angle them up, which means although you move your hands, your body stays in the same place and you have the same weight on the same muscles, probably why people don't like trekking bars much. Also it gives a more aero position for headwinds.
Cables? Clarkes or Jagwire. I got a set of stainless Jagwire branded off Ebay the other day for $10 delivered. Well they look OK (compressionless) and have Jagwire written on them and they are stainless.

veganbikes

"For hubs I would love to say Phil Wood, Paul Comp. White Industries, Chris King or Hope but that would probably be out of the budget and on the Paul Hubs you wouldn't find a rear easily (since they cannot source the freehubs anymore) So instead I would say Deore XT hubs would be a great choice. If not those SRAM X7s are nice because they are sealed bearing but you wouldn't want to replace the QRs with an internal cam QR or better yet get some Pinheads, Pitlocks or at least Delta Axlerods for wheel security." - Me

mrb09

If you're getting the Shimano group with the Shimano shifters, might want to check the fit on the trekking bars. I know Surly uses Microshift shifters on their bikes with Jones bars. I have the Shimano shifters on my Troll with flat mountain bars, and they do take a bit of room next to the brakes.

bikemig 

Same question. Actually I think my deore xt hubs must have the 12 mm axle as they're clearly oversized.

https://www.shimano.com/media/techdoc...9830753751.pdf

bikemig 

This might blow your budget but velocity has touring wheels at $400 a pair; the hubs are sealed cartridge hubs which I really like. I don't know whether the cassette body is steel but velocity can give you the answer. You have a choice of rims as well:

Velocity Wheels - Hand Made in USA

If looking to save money, velo mine has consistently good prices on built wheels and the build quality, in my experience, is quite good. The built wheels will cost you less than the parts:

26 Inch Wheelsets Velomine.com : Worldwide Bicycle Shop, fixed gear track bike wheelsets campagnolo super record vintage bike

The rhyno lite wheelset may be overbuilt for your needs but they are stout wheels built with DT spokes and deore hubs for all of $119 a pair:

https://www.velomine.com/index.php?ma...oducts_id=3756

fietsbob

I see Hundreds of cycletourists every summer (OR Coast) My own bike had Unique parts ..

Now I see the wisdom of using the most common Shimano Stuff .. as No time for replacing a custom rim.

so the fancy hubs get boxed up and Mailed to your House

and something Generic-shimano is put on your bike when you break a wheel,,

Campag is all special Order.. but there are plenty of hotel/Motel rooms and places to eat and drink while you wait.

wnylogo

BHS hubs would be a good choice. They are reasonably priced with a reliable record.

robert schlatte

I appreciate what you're trying to do but couldn't you have just bought a prebuilt Surly disc trucker and been with your total $1300 budget? In any event, to stay within your existing budget I would go with good but less expensive components. You can always upgrade later as you come into more $$$. I recently built a Soma Sage touring bike. I was in a similar situation as you, so what I did I looked at the LHT build list on Surly's website and purchased the same less expensive components. A couple years later now I have upgraded most of the cheaper components and transferred them to another bike I own. For instance my original seatpost was a Kalloy which I have upgraded to Thomson, original stem was Dimension upgraded to Soma, rims were Sun CR 18, now Velocity Dyad, Hubs were Shimano Tiagra, now are Shimano Deore LX, headset was FSA-pig, now Chris King. You get the idea.

Trevtassie

Yep, that's a good point. Better off using a dual control, but nothing available in 10 speed! A set of these ControlTech Terminator Plugs | Chain Reaction Cycles might be handy to mount the shifters on, to leave more hand room...