dahoneezz

Pacific Cycles

Above is manufacturer's site. Unfortunately, to go to the store, it is in chinese. You can find also Birdy parts on Ebay. The rear suspension is available, not cheap though. Finally, I thought I saw a recent post here where a new Birdy distributor was setting up shop in NYC (?).

www.bikeforums.net/folding-bikes/473415-birdy-thread-35.html

Post #868

BruceMetras

I have rear Birdy elastomers in stock if you want to go OEM..

berlinonaut

To be precise: One out of two manufacturers. Pacific cycles is the manufacturer of all birdy-frames, but who is the manufacturer of the bike depends on where you live. Pacific-Cycles covers more or less all of Asia, Riese and Müller (the original inventor) covers Europe and probably the rest of the world. Their site is here:

https://www.r-m.de/en-gb/

Not sure where you are living and also not sure who is the manufacturer of the Birdys that are/were sold in the US.
R-M do still provide a manual for the old model of the Birdy up to 2006, unfortunately only the German version (at least I did only find this one):

https://www.r-m.de/media/filer_publi...2d/ba_b_04.pdf

On page 54 are the torque-numbers, on page 55 the guide for inspection, so this may still be helpful. Or you could send them an email and ask if they have an english version available.

Over the years there have been a lot of changes on the Birdy, here's a German page that provides a changelog (in German) birdy-freunde - Modellpflege beim Birdy as well as a load of older documents, catalogues and manuals: birdy-freunde - Dokumentationen

jur

The Australian site is/used to be tops.

dahoneezz

My apologies. I thought most of the bikes nowadays are manufactured in Asia due to cost.

Bonzo Banana

Just seems like the prototype was designed in Germany but the commercial product was always made in Taiwan and later revisions were at least partially designed in Taiwan. What's also confusing is the huge Pacific cycles US bike importer and Pacific cycles of Taiwan don't appear to be the same company as far as I can tell despite the name. Even if kits are sent to Germany they are more designer and assembler rather than manufacturer in the same way as Canyon. Maybe my definition is wrong but it seems to me if I'm given a box of chinese bike parts and assemble them into a bike I am not the manufacturer of that bike but legal definitions may be different.

jur

Pacific Cycles CEO approached Reise&Mueller for a manufacturing license. He was so impressed by the design he wanted that on his list, and R&M struck a deal. The history is on Pacific Cycles web site I believe.

xwave151

Thank you so much for the help!

Is this the chain tensioner? It does look bent out of place...
Also my gears are a little wobbly. How do I tighten them up, or should I replace the entire system?

berlinonaut

Instead of guessing wildy you could just look in the Birdy-thread : https://www.bikeforums.net/folding-bi...l#post19442511

Sangetsu

Yes, this is the tensioner, you can probably straighten it enough for it to work, just make sure both rails are flat and straight from the eyelets to the 90 degree angle of the rubber coated part. Be careful to install the bolt and nut so the tensioner doesn't move, but that the derailleur pulley still turns freely. Without the chain retainer the chain may slip off the chain ring when folding or unfolding the bike. The retainer bolts on the the round boss on the top of the chain ring.

A little play in the gears is okay, but you can replace the components easily enough. The original parts are Shimano Sora, which are inexpensive, but you can install pretty much anything you like.

jur

xwave, contact brucemetras for the rubber rear suspension element. They work better than any 3rd party fancy-pants shiny suspension element. Not to mention much cheaper.

Bruce will also be able to provide other expert advice.

jur

Looks like that chain gatherer might have been caught in the cogs at one stage. See below for what a brand new one looks like.

Bonzo Banana

I actually went to birdy's own site under the impression that would be the most accurate source rather than forum postings.

With the further development of the Birdy and our first production ideas, we went on a quest for manufacturers at Eurobike 1994. We found a bike manufacturer there who turned Riese & Müller into a real company with the words, “I want to build this bicycle!”. After June 1995, Birdy was officially available to buy in Germany, Japan and the USA.

'quest for manufacturers' and near simultaneous date of availability across Germany, Japan and the USA. The fact they describe another company as the manufacturer and not themselves was I felt a subtle clue.

https://www.r-m.de/en-gb/company/history/

Also it does look like both companies with the issues and failings of the initial product feed back to them worked together to bring out a much improved later model. Hardly much speculation there when Pacific cycles have a huge R&D centre and are actually the manufacturer and distributor of the product around the world and so have to do all the tests and changes at the factory.

Also there isn't a single 'made in germany' or similar information on the Riese site as far as I can tell and normally German companies do that even if they just put a label on a box.

berlinonaut

Well I think the birdy can be called something like a "joint venture" between R+M and Pacific Cycles. The original design and concept came from R+M, the frames have always been built by Pacific. Today's aluminium frames are to my knowledge mainly built in Asia with very exceptions. So letting the frame be manufactured somewhere "offshore" is basically standard with most bicycle-companies that are not based in Asia.

Gearing comes from Shimano, Schwalbe tyres are made in Indonesia and so on and so on. Still: Choosing which components will be used and plugging them all together is AFAIK done in Germany (with the R+M version) but I am not totally sure.

Regarding the design I think both parties have their influence. So I'd still call the R+M version a German product, though the parts come from all over the world, thanks to globalisation. It is no different than in other industries, let it be electronics or cars...

But it seems that the Birdy (though it was the company's first product) is not that important for R+M today. They have a big lineup of bikes today, the Birdy being the only folder and seem to focus on their other bikes far more. And even here in Germany you do not see many Birdys on the streets in comparison to Bromptons (let alone Dahons and Terns), so even in it's home country it is a bit exotic. Probably the high pricetag has it's part in this as may have the not totally brilliant reputation of R+M in terms of service quality and after-sales customer focus.

Bonzo Banana

Well people who have them seem to love riding them even if you also hear of many strength and reliability issues which I guess have reduced over time as new revisions cured many of these problems. Does seem a high cost bike to both buy and maintain generally though. Personally I always aim for the sweet spot between price and quality which tends not to be entry level but not premium either and I hate bikes with non-standard parts for obvious rider wallet milking issues.

Sangetsu

In my experience, having owned two Birdies, (as well as two Dahons and a Brompton) they cost no more to maintain than any other bike. There are no non-standard parts on a Birdy, every component is off-the-shelf except for the suspension bushings and elastomers. If you like upgrades and modifications, the Birdy offers almost unlimited combinations. My 8 speed, Sora-eqipped Birdy now sports 20" wheels, and a Dura-Ace/XTR hybrid driveline with 22 speeds. Neither of my Birdies have had any reliability issues, other than one having a cracked elastomer.

jur

+1

berlinonaut

This may be true if you consider maintenance as "fix if something is broken". If you follow the inspection guide in the manual the routine swapping of parts like stem and fork parts in relatively short intervals make it definitively far more expensive. Plus you loose your warranty on the frame if you do not get a stamp in your book for a yearly inspection with a birdy dealer.
The required parts-swapping may seem to be a bit on the paranoid side of life (and therefor up to everybody's own judgement) but I've read a couple of incidents with those (and other) parts breaking even on newer birdies w/o mistreatment, therefor it doesn't seem to be totally irrational.

Regular parts swapping plus yearly inspection make it an expensive bike in terms of high running cost (plus a high price to get one at first). If you are willing to take the risk with parts breaking plus you don't care for the warranty on the frame (or you do not have any as you bought second-hand) you can run it cheaper.

Well: every part related to frame, stem and fork is non-standard (aside of the suspension). The front hub is uncommon at least as is the seat post. The racks are non-standard. The rims and spokes are uncommon. And so on and so on. I'd assume there are more non-standard-parts on a Birdy than standard ones. Standard is basically the rear hub, everything regarding shifting and breaking, the saddle and the bar. That should be pretty much it - most of the rest is more or less non-standard or at least uncommon. There's nothing wrong about that in my eyes - that's the price you have to pay for a special bike.

Bonzo Banana

I was going by the other posts in this thread which stated a frequent maintenance schedule often replacing expensive parts and the general warnings elsewhere which admittedly may be the early version. However from what you have stated it sounds like you have made quite a lot of investment in the bike to improve it. I had in mind people that buy a bike and with very simple maintenance pretty much do nothing else to the bike and can use it for many years and when a part does fail it is so widely available that they can get it at a good price. In addition to the frame and suspension parts and possibly issues with having 18" wheels I thought there might have been a few more specific parts admittedly especially around keeping the chain tensioned. However I don't know the cost of the specific parts or their frequency of replacement to gauge cost myself anyway and can only go with by what other's have written forums.

On the bike of this thread is it 7 speed with a cassette if so is that cassette hub easy to repair/maintain I thought such a hub might be quite a specialist part nowadays again not applicable to later Birdy's I'm sure. I think on some of the Dahon's some older models had a 7 speed cassette and the hub was difficult to repair/replace and later entry level Dahon's just downgraded to a tourney freewheel which while not as robust or reliable at least is easily replaced.

Diode100

I'm wondering if the OP isn't now thinking that the Dahon Mariner might have been the better choice for a biking newbie.

xwave151

LOL

I was admittedly having headaches all day today. I worked on the bike, took it all apart down to just fork and frame, and cleaned it like it's never been cleaned. I'm doing so, I have now thoroughly inspected every inch of the bike and find absolutely no issues other than the normal wear and tear paint clippings.

Although it has proven incredibly difficult to find replacement parts, let alone anything from the original manufacturer(s)...I will not turn my back on the Birdy. I've taken apart, cleaned and reinstalled the gears, chain and derailleur as well and all look fine. I'll update with pics when I can

As for the Mariner...oh I'll prob still get one! I'm actually going to check out a folder later this evening. If it passes the test, it'll be #2 in the collection! If I pull the trigger, I'll be sure to post pics as well

linberl

If the frame is good (as you have cleaned and checked) then the rest is FUN! Seems like most of the people on this forum, when they aren't riding, they are tweaking and upgrading and fixing, anyway. Plus, there is the incredible sense of satisfaction from having brought a used bike up to your level of perfection. Everytime Jur looks at his jaw-droppingly gorgeous Birdy, I am sure he is pleased. If you don't like to tinker and wrench at least a bit, you're missing out on half the fun.

Bonzo Banana

If the frame is 100% and you only have the suspension parts to replace it does sound like you have a bargain. A pretty cool bike too that is very rare it seems.

Any clues to the other bike you are looking at?

xwave151

There's a Giant Expressway I was thinking about picking up. Do you or anyone else know 0r have heard anything about those?

Sangetsu

The front hub I use is an Ultegra, it fits without any modification whatsoever. I could fit any 18 inch or 20 inch rim with regular spokes. I could just as easily use an origingal Sora hub, or a Dura Ace, or XTR, they all fit. A hub with a narrower flange width will allow a tighter fold, but the difference is negligible.

The funny thing is that neither of my bikes ever required any adjustment or repair of fork or neck parts, and this is on bikes which were ridden daily, and ridden hard at that. Nearly every full suspension mountain bike has model-specific parts, and models are updated with regularity, meaning that replacement parts for a particular model and year can be impossible to find. The so-called less reliable parts of early Birdy bikes can be replaced with parts from later models, as the two variations of the bike both remain in production today. I can buy a new fork assembly, neck, clamp parts, fork pivot bushings, and other parts for any Birdy of any model year, which is something not so easily done for other bikes.

I bought a new set ore spare pivot bolts and bushings, but after years of hard riding, the original parts still work properly, and have not needed replacing.