peterws

You think this lot are had? You want to take a look at the Piano World forum . . .
There are certainly strange responses amongst these, that's for sure!
But please appreciate that when those wheels are a-turning, the breathing's in synch with your legs and the side o' the carriageway is fast becoming a blur, you'll be bitten with the same bug. The Hill approaches. might only be a bridge over the railway, but . . up on the pedals you go. Full bore, pushing and pulling wi those old legs; no slowing down; the breathing's becoming of steam train proportions . . . .and those who watch can only gawp in astonishment!

Well, maybe not that last bit . . . . (grin)

big john

He's not an expert on Ironman, one of his bikes is a Centurion and Ironman Expert is the model.

When you go look at bikes there is going to be hype. If the speed thing doesn't matter to you don't let it bother you, just find the bike that works for you.

The 50+ forum isn't nasty, some of what is posted is just teasing/ribbing and some of it was kinda funny. A thick skin comes in handy on internet forums.

btw, I'm not a fast rider but I do like to try and keep up with faster people so the speed thing is a consideration for me, but I try to be reasonable about it.

kaos joe

I'm 57. I go fast when the mood strikes me to do so. I go slow when it doesn't. I can do both equally well.

What I want to know is, who is "macho camacho"?

big john

Hector "Macho" Camacho was a flamboyant and popular boxer who died in 2012. He had a son who also boxed.

Cyclcist11023131

You get to see more scenery👽🎃⛹️*♀️🏌️*♀️💐💩😾👀

79pmooney

I'm betting you never raced. I did. Being in that kind of condition and riding a bike that is a pure tool to allow that kind of speed is a real high. Being able to do it for long periods of time is an experience only a very small percentage of the population ever sees.

I am far, far from my racing days and will never pursue that dream again. But still, being able to get into condition to do the featured and feared climb of an organized ride hard, in the groove and on a perfect bike is that old high. Lolo Pass at a HR of 165 the whole way. Climbing the Rattlesnake on my first ti custom dialed in, everything perfect; my bike and my body. Dead Indian Memorial Highway out of Ashland, day 6 and day 4 of 5000'+ every day. 42-23; the lowest gear I owned. Tough, tough, tough but I did it, And the bike was my ally the whole time.

The newest, lightest, fastest bike out there is the tool to pursue that dream, that high. Yeah, the vast majority never do more than just ride their dream-maker but spending money to pursue highs is as old as currency. (Doing the work to make it happen on a bike is just that; far more work than most want to do.)

Now, I am not a weight weenie at all. My bikes have never been the lightest. The bikes in the 3 climbs I mentioned above weighed 24+, 23+ and 19 pounds. But they all fit like a dream so this body could produce everything physically possible. And about that aspect of my bikes, I am obsessive. (Like 3 custom frames, 3 custom stems, 2 custom seatposts, 2 unusually long production stems and 2 likewise setback seatposts.)

Oh, back to racing; a real part of the love of racing is getting to ride that fast for that long. Four hours at nearly 27 mph once in hilly country. (Very fast race.) That same summer I rode 175 miles twice alone, 160 miles twice, 120 miles with a 2000' mountaintop a bunch of times (Eastern Massachusetts, there weren't many places higher and non in that half of the state.) Being able to do those rides and keep them all within daylight hours meant that I had to ride fast to cover that much ground.

Just like hot cars are the tools to pursue the high of s**, light bikes are the tool to pursue the high of riding fast. As long as that high is there, it will be both pursued and the tools purchased to keep the dream alive.

Ben

FBOATSB

I'm 61. Today I rode 2 1/2 hours on a 36 year old bike that wieghs 36 pounds. Not fast. There, I said it. Please don't flame me for I have a very thin skin.

big john

Good post, Ben. I've done some centuries with 10,000 feet of climbing and one with 12,000 feet. A lighter bike can help a bit and a great handling bike can help with all the descending that comes with a lot of climbing.
Sometimes, getting a "faster" bike is to make the ride easier/better.

WNCGoater

Well I'm coming to this party a little late. I've had a similar experience on other forums of different subject matter. I don't see any real malicious intent here, half of us are just struggling to keep fit and stay mobile. Seems to me mentally I'm still in my teens/20's but physically, middle age isn't kind. I've outridden guys much younger on mountain bikes and been blown in the ditch by old timers on road bikes and unable to keep up with them.

At the end of the day...Ride your own ride.

Do what makes you happy and accomplishes your goals on a bike. If that goal is a leisurely easy 10 miler twice a week, then go for it. Just recognize you don't NEED carbon fiber, all the bells and whistles, nor speed to do that. Heck a WalMart Huffy will serve that purpose. (All the rest of you don't flame me for that comment.) Point is, things become "fashionable" and bike speed may be all the rage now. Next week it will be fat tires, or skinny saddles or, or, or...

Now I have ridden the past couple years maintaining 15mph. I live in mountainous terrain so my rides are fast downhills and slow climbs, still average 15. Two years ago I rode a 112 mile century at the coast, flat land. That was an accomplishment for me but I rode it at over 16 mph! For me, that was huge. This year for some reason I'm struggling to keep that 15 mph average. Not sure why. Conditioning? Aging? Extra 10 pounds? If I ride and I have a 16 mph average, I'm like, "YES!" If it's 14 mph I'm a little disappointed. Why? I don't know, it's kind of a measurement benchmark for me. Does it really matter? Heck no! Does it affect me? Maybe a little, if I don't maintain that speed I wonder why. Ego? Perhaps...

There's a mixed group locally, but mostly younger that ride in the evenings one day a week. I looked at the stats of one of the riders I know, who had invited me to ride with them. I thought, "shoot they rode 32 miles last night, I could do that." Then I saw they rode it in about 1 1/2 hour! I thought, uhhh, no.

Again, ride your own ride and ignore the speed if that isn't your thing and you don't use it as a measurement of progression or falling behind. There's people who will sneer at those who don't have a matching jersey and shorts, or use a headlight or taillight, or a dorky mirror on their helmet, or leave that little plastic disc between their cassette and spokes, the world is full of people who have different "ideas" on what is important. Projecting those bias' onto others or ridiculing them for having different priorities just shows what type person you are.

One more time, ride your own ride, do what you enjoy, forget what anyone thinks but get out there and ride!

kaos joe

Excellent post, Ben. I can't claim any racing triumphs, but I like to go fast and I get it. You either get it, or you don't.

A dearly departed (or so he says) poster on the Long Island thread once compared riding to taking a bus to work or some such. Clearly one of the latter. Also more than once denigrated riders with a different perspective than his, which annoyed some people.

79pmooney

I haven't quite made the 100 and 10,000 yet. In my post above, the first of the 4 days of 5000'+ was the Cycle Oregon day to Crater Lake and around. 88 miles and 8800'. I took a wrong turn and descended at least 1000' and a real 5 miles. Had to backtrack. So 98 and 9800'+. Almost made the magic numbers. (And on a fix gear with 3 choices of cogs, 42 X 17, 23 and 12. (It took another 5 years before I located a 24 tooth I purchased from England.)

Oh, another of those epic climbs, Cycle Oregon 2012. Day 4. 2 miles with percents hitting 14% twice. My logo photo was taken there on the 14.5% 42 X 17! (I didn't realize that hill was the steep one until I was into it and didn't want to stop!)

Ben

MidSouthBiker

I feel like my legs get a great workout on my Tank, the 30 something pound Hybrid. But, speed sells in most shops, and that's an easy way to attract the dollars. When I was buying my road bike, I was comparing the 105 component bike with that next level up bike with all the lighter, bigger, better, and seemingly faster gadgets. I asked the shop owner point blank, that given my age(old and slow) and expertise (lack of), would spending all that much more money be really that cost beneficial. In other words would I really get that much more out of the really higher priced one? He was very honest by saying probably not. But, he got the sale on the 105 road bike.

canklecat

I was making fun of myself. And I absolutely understand where you're coming from.

16 years ago my compact car was t-boned at highway speed by a full sized SUV. Broke six vertebrae in my back and neck. My C2 is permanently damaged. For years I walked with a cane, and was finally able to do without it for long walks around 2014.

In 2015 I resumed cycling after 30 years away. I could barely ride a mile and usually had to stop every 400 yards to catch my breath. Besides the back and neck injuries I have Hashimoto's thyroiditis and my asthma has gotten worse with age. At the time my only goal was to ride my big ol' heavy errand bike to and from the grocery store, about a 2 mile round trip. Some days I had to walk the bike back home -- it's fairly steep grade, especially with a bike loaded down with groceries.

By the end of 2015 I was able to ride up to 20 mile round trips, with lots of rest stops. My average speed was a leisurely 8-9 mph. And that was just fine with me.

By the one year anniversary of resuming cycling, the end of August 2016, I rode my age, plus a little for a metric century, or 63 miles. Took a lot of rest breaks. The entire trip took 13 hours, which might violate some unwritten rule about completing these marathon excursions within 12 hours, I dunno. Don't care. I did it.

Treated myself to a slightly lighter weight bike that fit me better. I had to modify it for comfort, with riser handlebars because my neck still ached most days. Rode the heck out of it. Got faster, although that wasn't the goal. Speed and distance just naturally followed more riding.

By June this year, nearly two years back in the saddle, I felt ready for another challenge. I got an inexpensive used road bike with drop bars (the Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert you noticed -- that's what they called it because it was ridden by Hawaiian Ironman triathlete Dave Scott in the 1980s), the first I'd ridden in more than 30 years. It was painful for the first couple of weeks. It was somewhat less painful after four weeks. By the sixth week I began to look forward to the rides. I pushed harder, rode faster and got past a plateau in conditioning where I'd peaked a few months ago.

But I'm never going to be fast, not even in my age group (I'm 59). The fastest guys in my age group locally are literally twice my speed on every Strava segment, and a third faster than me overall on the same 20 mile or longer routes. Even if the doctors found a cure for Hashimoto's (which is annoying and debilitating, but not fatal) and asthma, I'd still never be that fast.

And that's okay. I'm not competing with anyone. I'm just working on overcoming the psychological barriers I'd accumulated over the years after that car wreck. I had almost no help or hope from anyone or any agency in physical recovery. The $5,000 insurance settlement barely covered the most basic medical expenses the firsts year of recovery. After that I was on my own.

My goal this year was to break the 16 mph ceiling I kept butting up against on a 20-30 mile route I'd ridden dozens of times. And I finally did it last week.

And it's not about the speed. It's about reconditioning my entire mindset and shaking loose from the negativity that had bogged me down. Set a reasonable goal. Struggle for it. Meet it, beat it, and move on to the next thing.

But my favorite rides are still the leisurely group rides with the friends I've made in the local bicycling community. We usually ride about 11 mph. And that's just fine with me. Sometimes I can join them once a week. Sometimes only once a month. It's always the highlight of that week or month. I look forward to those more than my faster solo rides.

Same here. I've been the live-in caregiver for my mom for 10 years, since she began experiencing a sudden onset of dementia with memory loss and disorientation following a head injury and complications from surgery. She cannot live alone, and our combined income won't cover the expenses of a dependable full time nurse's aide or decent nursing home.

And mom is my third family member I've looked after at home so they could live out their days in their own home. The first two were my grandparents, 12 years apart, and included in-home hospice care for my grandmother. My background is in health care and I was the most logical person to take on the role. I've never been paid a dime for it. Whatever income I make I scrape together from other sources. When I first began looking after my grandparents I also worked full time. After the car wreck I was unable to work for years. It doesn't get any easier with age.

So, yeah, I understand what you're experiencing. And any form of exercise and physical activity we can do helps a lot.

So keep pedaling and enjoy the ride. Don't worry about the speed or distance or what the local bike shops say. And don't assume there's an oppositional attitude here. A dark sense of humor, maybe. Let's face it, we're on the downhill slide past age 50. Whether we like it or not, the finish line is coming up very quickly. We're fast, whether we like it or not. Might as well enjoy the ride.

big john

Fixed gear riders amaze me. Friend and bf member Shprung has done everything fixed, including Furnace Creek 508, Silver State 508, PBP twice and another 1200k thing here in California.

gregf83 

You're not alone. The vast majority of cyclists have a very similar mindset to you and have no interest in speed but just ride their bikes. They also don't tend to spend time on bike forums...

icyclist 

The question, OP, is why you ride so slowly. ;-)

What are the names of the bike shops you've visited with salespeople who want to talk abou speed?

70sSanO

To the OP... There is nothing wrong with the dealers, the problem is you are looking at the wrong bikes. If you walk into a shop and are looking at 11 speed road bikes, that is what you are going to get. Heck, it was the same way 30 years ago.

But if you really interested in a durable bike for recreation purposes, go look at bikes with an internal gear hub. There is an interesting bike manufacturer I recently stumbled upon called Priority. Not my style, but I'm just throwing it out because it is low maintenance and might fit your riding style. Maybe a frame from Soma or Surly might be a good way to go.

As for components, if you are looking for the latest, but durable, and not setup for speed you are maybe 20+ years too late. I imagine others will disagree, but the current components are far superior for performance, but probably require more attention to keep them at that level. For example, good 32/36 spoke wheels will require less maintenance than lightweight 20 spoke wheels, unfortunately you pay a penalty for weight and there are not a lot of high quality high spoke wheels.

Admittedly I ride older technology, not as fast (even though I like to ride fast... relatively speaking) as I used to be but it is fun push myself. The one thing I can identify with is going with a lighter and more modern bike and maybe pickup 1mph or less on my average. I don't hold anything against fast riders on the latest fast gear, but it is not the same as your 15mph to 10mph analogy.

John

MinnMan

mods! mods!

OP, go read the very recent now-closed thread "The Riding Philosphies of Retired Cyclists".

Then go ride your bike however you like. And stop bothering us.

BlazingPedals

I tend to talk about a bike being 'faster' but really going faster on the same amount of power is just a different way of saying, going the same speed with less power. Does getting home from a fixed-length ride less tired, or doing more miles to reach the same degree of tiredness, interest you?

canklecat

IGH bikes aren't necessarily slow. One of my friends consistently kicks my butt on his IGH hybrids. He's modded them slightly with flipped albatross bars and clipless pedals. But mostly he's gotten stronger quickly while my progress has been much slower.

Just Saturday he rode 48 miles of a large group ride averaging 17 mph with the heat index well over 100F. I couldn't even make that ride because I was recovering from a Friday solo ride of 30 miles on relatively flatter terrain and I averaged just over 16 mph. But he's a youngster in his 40s and well on his way to becoming a bicycle beast. Once he admits he's ready for a carbon road bike we'll never catch him.

The OPs aren't really comparable. I can understand the concerns of the OP in this thread, even if he seems a bit too sensitive about how others perceive his preferences for leisurely rides. But understanding more about his background, which he shared later in the thread, I can relate to the stresses and pressures that might exaggerate the significance of what other cyclists think about slower riders.

BookFinder 

I feel your pain, and to get to the answer to your question - what you are hearing and experiencing is called projection - that is, when an individual pushes what is going on inside of them into the conversation or circumstances.

The sales guys have a certain model, or image in their head of what the consumer wants. That image is shaped by all kinds of influences, including the club riding and racer images prominent in bicycling. For example, look at the dominant advertising imagery - guys with shaved legs pushing into the wind, or riding like mad to stay ahead of the pack.

Next, they are trapped within certain limitations imposed by inventory, quota expectations, historic stats on who shops the store, etc. They are predisposed to expecting a certain type of customer. All of that and more is feeding into their mindset, so you come in asking for a certain thing and they try and sell you something else.

The same thing happens with auto sales. Several years ago - in fact, probably 10 years now, my wife saw a vehicle online at a local dealership website and called about it. That vehicle had been sold when she called (duh) but she spent maybe 10 minutes online telling the sales guy what she was looking for.

He called back three times in the next week with "pitches" on "showroom clean" trades they had taken in - none of which was what she wanted. She finally said "don't call back - I've found exactly what I want somewhere else." Which was true - we found it "on the grapevine" and contacted the vehicle owner. We are Dave Ramsey pay as you go types - she is still driving that car.

Anyway, at the end of the day I've found it necessary to say to sales people, "I'm going to tell you what I want and you need to be listening, because if I realize after just a few minutes that you don't have it, can't get it, or don't want to try, I'm going to conclude you don't want my business. So if you don't listen to me now while I explain what I want, the next thing you hear will be the door slamming as I leave."

caloso

I'm wondering where these shops are. I have to believe they exist since they are such a popular subject on BF. We have quite a few excellent local bike shops in Sacramento, some local, some chains, some more race oriented, some more utility-oriented. But none has ever tried to push me towards a bike I wasn't interested in.

Bandera

This sub-forum is fairly diverse in it's interests/objectives in riding a bicycle.

Just because it is "Fifty Plus (50+)" it is unwise to assume that all folk of a certain age are not interested in the traditional aspects of Cycling as a Sport with the emphasis on developing/maintaining the endurance, power and speed necessary to keep at it until an advanced age. Among the fastest and most competitive age classes in USAC racing are Masters, right in the age cadre of this sub-forum. Those of us of Emeritus status who no longer race but still put in the hard work required to ride challenging terrain at pace post here in that mode too.

Those new to the activity of riding a bicycle as an adult will be exposed to the posts of those who have spent decades putting in lots of seat time and discussing metrics. No different than playing a round of golf and being asked "So, what did you shoot?" We do keep score too.

That being said I ride a bike for errands and plooter about as well as Cycling, it's all Good but some bike rides do not make for interesting posts on BF.
"Today I was stopped at three traffic controls having to put a foot down, the broken glass along the curb at the HEB was daunting but I heroically managed to take a six of Shiner Bock home without a flat." Uh.....

As always, suit yourself.

-Bandera

Rje58

Personally, I think dandak and elocs are being a little oversensitive, and possibly even a little insensitive.

I'm relatively new to these forums. I just started back riding bicycles about six weeks ago, in June, after 40+ years of riding rental bikes only occasionally while on vacation, and not even owning a bike.

I don't have a new road bike that cost $2800, and I don't ride very fast. I bought a 20-year-old Trek 830 off Craigslist for $70 that had like new hybrid tires on it (26x1.5) and did another $70 worth of mods, added a few accessories (speedometer, headlight, taillight, bag) and off I went. The longest ride I've done is 30.6 miles so far, and my average speed hovers around 12 mph, depending upon terrain and environmental conditions.

The point of the previous paragraph is that I'm not a high-dollar bike snob or a speed demon. But I find this to be a very interesting and mostly friendly forum, especially the '50+' and 'Clydesdales and Athenas' sections where I usually hang out.

They may not have realized it, but what dandek and elocs have done is sorta the equivalent of walking into a craft beer bar with 50+ craft beers on tap, and taking a spoon and banging on a glass to get everyone's attention, and then saying "What's the big deal with craft beers? Why aren't Pabst Blue Ribbon and Schlitz good enough for you guys? Who could need anything better than a Coors or a Bud?" and then getting bent out of shape and talking about how "defensive and unfriendly" the craft beer drinkers are, when they get the responses that they should have expected to get.

elocs

Yes, God forbid that anyone should bother you (us?) by expressing their opinion.