Track bike on smart trainer?
#51
Elitist
All this talk about Lemond trainers has me curious. I've never used one.
How would you describe the feel? Can you load initial resistance on it for standing starts? Or is it simply best used for rolling stuff at speed?
How would you describe the feel? Can you load initial resistance on it for standing starts? Or is it simply best used for rolling stuff at speed?
#52
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Tacoma, WA
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Bikes: 2015 Fuji Track Elite, 1990-something Steel Fuji Fixie conversion
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Looks like TrackHackSolutions on facebook is selling these for $250 each. That seems a little steep.
I'm going to modify the bearing pressfit dimensions and send the drawing back to my machinist, then I'll see how much he'll charge for 5 or 10 of these.
The typical road skewer works fine, all it needed was two spacers from a leftover fixed gear hub, and I cut down the sleeve from the original shimano freewheel setup (seen in black on the spindle).
https://photos.app.goo.gl/FoxdaLWSLG7OYVLD2
https://photos.app.goo.gl/x2jErEB3q7NtNMik2
chainline looks perfect:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/quD6ssJacoKbbyoq1
As far as standing starts, I'd say it'll work fine. It has a lot of intertia, but not as much as a 220lb guy on the track, so to mimic that I would run a larger gear than on the track for standing starts. I'll try some starts on it tonight and see how it goes.
I'm going to modify the bearing pressfit dimensions and send the drawing back to my machinist, then I'll see how much he'll charge for 5 or 10 of these.
The typical road skewer works fine, all it needed was two spacers from a leftover fixed gear hub, and I cut down the sleeve from the original shimano freewheel setup (seen in black on the spindle).
https://photos.app.goo.gl/FoxdaLWSLG7OYVLD2
https://photos.app.goo.gl/x2jErEB3q7NtNMik2
chainline looks perfect:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/quD6ssJacoKbbyoq1
As far as standing starts, I'd say it'll work fine. It has a lot of intertia, but not as much as a 220lb guy on the track, so to mimic that I would run a larger gear than on the track for standing starts. I'll try some starts on it tonight and see how it goes.
#54
Elitist
Looks like TrackHackSolutions on facebook is selling these for $250 each. That seems a little steep.
I'm going to modify the bearing pressfit dimensions and send the drawing back to my machinist, then I'll see how much he'll charge for 5 or 10 of these.
The typical road skewer works fine, all it needed was two spacers from a leftover fixed gear hub, and I cut down the sleeve from the original shimano freewheel setup (seen in black on the spindle).
https://photos.app.goo.gl/FoxdaLWSLG7OYVLD2
https://photos.app.goo.gl/x2jErEB3q7NtNMik2
chainline looks perfect:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/quD6ssJacoKbbyoq1
As far as standing starts, I'd say it'll work fine. It has a lot of intertia, but not as much as a 220lb guy on the track, so to mimic that I would run a larger gear than on the track for standing starts. I'll try some starts on it tonight and see how it goes.
I'm going to modify the bearing pressfit dimensions and send the drawing back to my machinist, then I'll see how much he'll charge for 5 or 10 of these.
The typical road skewer works fine, all it needed was two spacers from a leftover fixed gear hub, and I cut down the sleeve from the original shimano freewheel setup (seen in black on the spindle).
https://photos.app.goo.gl/FoxdaLWSLG7OYVLD2
https://photos.app.goo.gl/x2jErEB3q7NtNMik2
chainline looks perfect:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/quD6ssJacoKbbyoq1
As far as standing starts, I'd say it'll work fine. It has a lot of intertia, but not as much as a 220lb guy on the track, so to mimic that I would run a larger gear than on the track for standing starts. I'll try some starts on it tonight and see how it goes.
One good thing is that since you are using a proper track cog on the rear, you could rig up a way to put the speed sensor next to the flywheel that would have a magnet doube-sided taped to it. And that would get you speed that might be close to real world simulations. It would a nice bonus to find that it's calibrated to provide exponential resistance based on the speed of the flywheel and having it match the real world for a given generic CdA.
Also, maybe engage a chain tensioner on the drive side before doing starts. The skewers may allow for slipping.
One more question: Does the fan have some sort of gate on it to allow you to fine-tune resistance like the Wattbike does? Are you doomed to have to switch chainrings/cogs to get different resistance levels?
#55
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Tacoma, WA
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Bikes: 2015 Fuji Track Elite, 1990-something Steel Fuji Fixie conversion
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Thanks guys! Yeah, I'm sure that would work, however I have the wattbox power meter for mine which uses a magnet placed on the non-drive side of the 'wheel'. It uses the known mass of the flywheel and takes into account pressure and temperature to estimate force to spin the fan. Not as exact as a strain-gauge power meter but it'll work for me.
https://www.bikerumor.com/2014/01/27...-now-shipping/
If the skewer slips during starts, I'll just throw a track nut on the drive side since the spindle threads are the same as rear hub axle threads.
You're stuck switching gears if you want to change resistance which is unfortunate for warmup to workout-effort transitions. The fan isn't adjustable and if it were, the power meter would be really inaccurate.
https://www.bikerumor.com/2014/01/27...-now-shipping/
If the skewer slips during starts, I'll just throw a track nut on the drive side since the spindle threads are the same as rear hub axle threads.
You're stuck switching gears if you want to change resistance which is unfortunate for warmup to workout-effort transitions. The fan isn't adjustable and if it were, the power meter would be really inaccurate.
#57
#58
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I use the standard cone cups, work fine with the track nuts on my fuji. It comes with one slotted and one non-slotted cup, but I ordered an extra non-slotted so that they match. Haven't tried the "Track Cone Cups" so can't comment if they are any better.
#59
Elitist
How are these Track Cone Cups to be used? I've never seen them before.
EDIT: Answered my own question:
https://support.kurtkinetic.com/hc/e...with-axle-nuts
EDIT: Answered my own question:
https://support.kurtkinetic.com/hc/e...with-axle-nuts
Single speed or track bikes will need either two of the Standard Cone Cups (shown above) or two of the Track Cone Cups which are slightly larger than the Standard Cone Cup. Current model Kinetic trainers come with one Standard cup and one Slotted Cup. Bikes with standard 15mm axle nuts will work with the Standard Cone Cup on both sides. (image above)
Check to see if the axle nuts fit securely inside the Standard Cone Cup (image below). Some track bikes have axle nuts that are larger or do not fit well in the Standard Cone Cup that comes on the trainer. Those bikes will require our Track Cone Cups on both sides.
Check to see if the axle nuts fit securely inside the Standard Cone Cup (image below). Some track bikes have axle nuts that are larger or do not fit well in the Standard Cone Cup that comes on the trainer. Those bikes will require our Track Cone Cups on both sides.
#60
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Like [MENTION=34156]carleton[/MENTION] posted the standard cone cups fit over the track nuts. I specifically bought the Kurt Kinetic trainer because you can use them with 120mm spaced hubs. The Wahoo trainers for example won't work, so keep that in mind when shopping around. Calibrating a fixed gear is a little funny since you have to take your feet off the pedals to "coast" but otherwise sets up fine. The smart trainers also have ERG mode which is really useful.
I got the rock n' roll version since i wanted to be able to stand up and sprint more naturally, it's a neat feature but the unit itself is a BEAST. it's definitely something you need to leave set up, unlike some smaller lightweight trainers you could move out of the way. Doing some rearranging as I just got a new monitor and Apple TV 4k to run Zwift on instead of the laptop I was using. I'll post some pictures up if you're interested.
I got the rock n' roll version since i wanted to be able to stand up and sprint more naturally, it's a neat feature but the unit itself is a BEAST. it's definitely something you need to leave set up, unlike some smaller lightweight trainers you could move out of the way. Doing some rearranging as I just got a new monitor and Apple TV 4k to run Zwift on instead of the laptop I was using. I'll post some pictures up if you're interested.
#61
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Location: Tacoma, WA
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Did quite a few standing starts and hard efforts on it and the skewer wasn't slipping at all.
Finally having a power meter -- even if it is on a trainer -- is a game changer for me.
#62
Elitist
https://photos.app.goo.gl/9JTdVfrPH07lAArC3
Did quite a few standing starts and hard efforts on it and the skewer wasn't slipping at all.
Finally having a power meter -- even if it is on a trainer -- is a game changer for me.
Did quite a few standing starts and hard efforts on it and the skewer wasn't slipping at all.
Finally having a power meter -- even if it is on a trainer -- is a game changer for me.
#63
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Finally got 10 parts back from the machine shop! I'll press in bearing and put together kits with fasteners and spacers then put these up for sale.
https://photos.app.goo.gl/whPtADWFhyvKgQrMA
https://photos.app.goo.gl/whPtADWFhyvKgQrMA
#64
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Join Date: Aug 2008
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Bikes: Fuji Elite, 3Rensho track, Trek Madone 6.9, Specialized MTB, GT MTB, Cannondale Cad3 fixie
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I just started using a CycleOps Magna with my track bike. I do a lot of interval training on it when I can't get to VSC and it works well. The only problem I have had is that when you rest in between sets, the trainer goes to sleep and it takes a couple of minutes for it to wake up and settle down to the selected resistance. It seems to default to huge resistance, which is a little bit tough when you are doing rev-ups. Works for practicing standing starts though! I like the basic structural configuration because it has a notched selector on the frame that adjusts for three different drop out distances. I guess I am just lazy, and really like being able to easily change the configuration between road and track bike sizes.
#66
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Yes sir, I just finished putting the kits together but still working on writing installation instructions. I have 10 for sale that are all ready to ship, I just put them up on my otherwise blank website. Let me know if you have any questions
https://sasquatchlegs.com/shop?olsPage=products
https://sasquatchlegs.com/shop?olsPage=products
#67
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Boise, ID
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Bikes: S-Works Venge Dura-Ace DI2, KTM Strada 4000, Fuji Norcom Straight 1.3 (TT), Fuji Track Elite, BMC Trackmachine TR02
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Not sure where to put this, but I have since given up on figuring out a way to put my track bike on a smart trainer with its own drive train/cassette. I found a solution that works better for me. I connect my power meter my training app (Rouvy), and use Kreitler rollers with the killer headwind fan. I find that with some trial and error and using the various settings on the fan, I can match the resistance of the sprint lane on a velodrome. This allows me to do these new Rouvy virtual workouts I just uploaded with synced video, taken last weekend.
Hopefully this attracts a few others who are stuck indoors most of the winter and looking for some velodrome virtual rides with synced video. Beats doing Z2-3 on rollers and staring at a mote of dust in the air. ;-) I recorded some GoPro footage last weekend at the Alpenrose Velodrome in Portland, OR, and created 4 routes:
500m TT — https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7468?useHost=1
18K (11mi) — https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7448?useHost=1
26K (16mi) — https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7455?useHost=1
40K (24.7mi) - https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7458?useHost=1
Hopefully this attracts a few others who are stuck indoors most of the winter and looking for some velodrome virtual rides with synced video. Beats doing Z2-3 on rollers and staring at a mote of dust in the air. ;-) I recorded some GoPro footage last weekend at the Alpenrose Velodrome in Portland, OR, and created 4 routes:
500m TT — https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7468?useHost=1
18K (11mi) — https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7448?useHost=1
26K (16mi) — https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7455?useHost=1
40K (24.7mi) - https://my.rouvy.com/virtual-routes/...7458?useHost=1
#68
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Yes sir, I just finished putting the kits together but still working on writing installation instructions. I have 10 for sale that are all ready to ship, I just put them up on my otherwise blank website. Let me know if you have any questions
https://sasquatchlegs.com/shop?olsPage=products
https://sasquatchlegs.com/shop?olsPage=products
#69
Just adding this here for anyone who finds this thread via google like i have in the past, but i have recently discovered this adaptor from NZ company Velobike. This fixes the 120mm spacing issue and allows you to fit a fixed gear track bike to the 2014 and 2016 Wahoo Kickrs. Not sure about the most recent versions. https://www.velobike.co.nz/wahoo-adaptor It is quite expensive though, but i guess thats the nture of the beast for small batch parts.
About to buy soon so will update with my experiences once i have had a chance t put some hours on it. Still recovering from herniated disc so may be a while before i can give it a real sprint effort test.
About to buy soon so will update with my experiences once i have had a chance t put some hours on it. Still recovering from herniated disc so may be a while before i can give it a real sprint effort test.
#70
Senior Member
The CycleOps Magnus wheel on trainer has a setting for 120 mm spacing. I use mine in ergo mode. It seems to work best in a bigger gear. I build workouts on TrainingPeaks and run them on Zwift.
#71
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One other option to consider is the Stac Zero Halcyon. It’s very flexible in adapting to different axel sizes, so you can quickly switch from a road bike to track bike to just about whatever. I’ve been using one all year and have been quite happy with the performance and features. It’s also quite portable and runs off a battery so it’s easy to take to the track or races for a warm-up.
#72
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I do the same, I use my 54t and a 14t cog and use Erg mode for everything but all out sprints.
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#74
We have now made one fro the Generation 4 (2018) Kickr, and about to release one for the Tacx Flux. The Neo will be next =)
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