Millstone

I have one that I build up from a bare (2nd hand) frameset. Indeed, very satisfying. :-)
But if possible: buy a frame with the headset. I found that the most difficult part with home-brew tools. Next time I'll have it installed by a LBS (I'd normally do that but this was a good opportunity to try it out).
Rest of the tools you might need you either already have, or are low cost.

Good luck! Have fun. Learn. Be proud of what you build and stay safe.

BTinNYC 

These things are important to me with an old frame that I want build out; room for 32mm tires, BSA bottom bracket, and the chainstay cable stop mounted on the bottom. I prefer brazed-on shifter bosses and 2 bottle cage mounts. Since you're starting from scratch, you can use 650B rims to fit wider tires on racy frame.

I find 32mm tires very comfortable yet fast, and I want a modern (2x9 - 2x12) drivetrain.

ImagineZH

Older bike was a Dawes Audax Giro, as below (not my bike or photo, though mine was the same frame)



Which reminds me, I still have that bike (it died due to excessive rust). I could surely reuse a lot of the parts on it.

georges1

I will put my two cents here. First check for corrosion at the bottom bracket, head tube, seat post and see also if there are no craks whether on welds or lugs, deep gouges or dents are also an indicator to be wary of.The Reynolds 531C or 531P are some of my favorite much more than the SL and SLX. Also be careful of tire clearance. The first frame would be my choice because of the 130mm rear spacing which gives you the ability to ride a modern group on it.

ImagineZH

Actually, while we're here I might as well ask. This is my old frame two of my LBS said is unfixable. Is this a fair assessment, or a bit cautious? (I can understand them not wanting to waste their time on something like this)

jdawginsc 

De rust and see if there’s enough tube left. Especially in that second picture.

soyabean

I love looking at other folk's "long term projects" here on BF.

I live out my restoration dreams thru them, while I waste my time on pure cycling.

Good pics, keep me posted

ImagineZH

There's enough time in one's life for both, right? I can cycle when I like, and then when I want something more hands on I can try build the bike. Or should every minute not spend posting on bikeforums.net be spent cycling?

ImagineZH

Tried with sandpaper for a while but was getting nowhere. Then tried with some sort of acid (can't remember its name) which is supposedly good for rust, but I had other problems there. I've tried with that frame, but there were a lot of problems that kept coming up (e.g. the seatpost is stuck and my LBS couldn't remove it either, and the bottom bracket is stuck too)

Mr. 66

Eh, the frame is probably, usable. If you want a project and you like it one could repaint. The epoxy paints are very durable.

slow rollin

Found your project

Jokes aside the LBS probably told you it's unfixable due to a cost+liability issue. The only way for you to know how it is is to sand it down, and find out how it is. Just fixing that or even finding out what's underneath the rust is a good start, then you will know if you can repair and ride or get a new frame with similar capabilities.
I like to have a bike project on the backburner most of the time, so I look frequently and pick up cheap deals that don't have the best listing, or paintjob. Then I get to it when I want.

IdahoBrett 

You should do all those things. I do and suspect many others do as well. Spending time here on BF will give you ideas you might not have thought of otherwise. Such as component selection, derusting products, polishing products and processes for both. Best of all you might learn of bike brands/models that you didn’t know existed. Your collection will grow if you keep coming back here. The knowledge and generosity of members here is unparalleled in any hobby that I’ve been involved with. Enjoy it your way at your own pace.

smd4

There is definitely a group on these boards who look down on anyone who does anything with bikes other than ride them. They think they're superior beings because of the miles they log.

Mr. 66

Oh stuck post and bb?! Kroil or PB Blaster will assist on the removals. Heat can help also.

Im wondering if the lbs actually tried removing the bb, most if not all shops won’t quote a stick post removal. I’m not surprised they did want to touch.

Back in the day I used a roto-stripper. It’s a drill attachment, it came in 3 different wire gaged wheels. It’s like a media blaster. There are other type of drill abrasive attachments, I just don’t know those products’ brands. An old school light wire brush can handle rust.

ImagineZH

Yeah I think liability was a part of it too - he wouldn't even fix a small issue on the brakes because he didn't want to be somehow tied to the bike!

Maybe I should give this bike another go and if I get nothing from it, I'll move on. Any ideas with the seized/rusted/worn/stuck bottom bracket?

soyabean

Shops don't want to have an unsuccessful attempt and return the frame with a now chewed up seatpost, where the Karens and Kens will tell the manager "well it wasn't like that when I left the bike here."

I always remove impossible BB's with my mapp torch. This does burn the area, but that's more forgiving to get a client to agree to since it gets all covered by the crankset upon assembly.

Aardwolf

I'd definitely try removing the rust to see what the frame is really like.

Here's one I bought:

Ebay advert


Attacked it with oxalic acid then rust remover then a dremel with a wire brush

ImagineZH

That looked so much like my bike in the first photo that I wasn't actually sure that you didn't just reuse my photo. Good to see something can (sometimes) be done!

jdawginsc 

36mm 18-20” long combination wrench affixed to flats with bolt and wagers/bits.. Clamping works as well...

Kroil. Kroil. Then let it rip. You can actually get a breaker extension to it as well.

AdventureManCO 

What a fun thread.

What is that rusty frame tubing made from? The thinner the tubing (typically, the higher the quality), the more compromised a frame can get from corrosion. One of the benefits of riding a super thick, chunky gas pipe framed bike

OP, that frame is likely save-able, but sometimes we also want a new project! There are a zillion different directions you can take it. Are you located in a place other than the USA? If so, maybe you can tell us what type of bikes or bike projects you have access to and that will help.

ImagineZH

I've enjoyed it too, I did not expect this level of feedback, it's been great.

The older bike is Reynolds 531C. I'm in Switzerland and there are some second hand selling websites where I could source a frame or a full bike, and/or plenty of parts.

Something I forgot to mention until now, is that the older bike frame did already break once. But it was quite a clean break (right through the tube, on the down tube, near where the downtube shifters would be - presumably from a front on crash I had once with a car). But I know a guy who knew a guy who welded it back together and it lasted years after.

dedhed

top506

Stealing this.......

Top

Road Fan

As. professional systems engineer, I think mapping out requirements can become way too complex, though I try to do it. But I have near 60 years experience, and repechage (I imagine) more, certainly in most aspects. I’ve recently bought a Mercian King of Mercia, about 1975, long and graceful. My concerns were size/fit, clearances for my intended gearings (Campy 2 or 3 in front and 8 through 11 in back with caliper brakes), and fender eyelets. Now maybe that’s all the requirements definition that I need, but it’s my experience that lets me make these choices very quickly,

To the Thread Starter, I learned not by starting with frames, but with bicycles that I liked. I would think about how to recognize when a bike is like that well-loved old one. Buy that example as new as you can, and use friends, books, people like us, and online resources (Lennard Zinn, RJ the Bike Guy, or a repair class in a Community Education program local to you) to set up, adjust, fine tune, and maintain that complete bicycle.

This way you get to discover, ride, learn and see more of the world sooner, spending only the minimum on bike shop labor fees.

Also I don’t know if it’s available, but the websites by an old-timer here, Randy Jawa, addressed these matters brilliantly, if you can find them.

How old would your ideal road bike be? In the early 1970s there were a lot of pretty good-riding bikes from Italy, notably Atala, Fiorelli, Bianchi, and Bottecchia, I suggest these over French bikes because of the concerns over French threaded parts. but these are all friction shifted bikes.

ImagineZH

So, an update:

I found a guy near me who could help with derusting my old Dawes bike, so I send it to him to see what he could do. He removed the bottom bracket no problem, but couldn't remove the seat post, so had to send the frame back without even starting at the rust!

I will have a go at removing the seatpost myself, but I have little confidence really...so I've started tentatively looking at buying a frame and building up from that, my original idea. Any ideas or comments on these three potential frames would be great:

GERBER Reynolds 531 Campagnolo Frame Stahl Rennvelo Rahmen | Kaufen auf Ricardo

Rennvelo Rahmen Mondia 58 cm | Kaufen auf Ricardo

OCHSNER GIOS Rennvelo Stahl Rahmen 58 RAR | Kaufen auf Ricardo

And a fully kitted out bike, for interest:

Coronado Rennvelo (Schweizer Rennrad Vintage Stahlrahmen) | Kaufen auf Ricardo

Thanks!