Why can't we lease bicycles ?
#26
Senior Member
#27
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,278
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4260 Post(s)
Liked 1,362 Times
in
944 Posts
Knowing it's not big is useful information.
I'd guess the OP is in the US.
Leasing for companies is another thing (it's an accounting trick). So, that doesn't seem relevant to the OP's question.
Last edited by njkayaker; 07-07-22 at 08:00 AM.
#28
Tragically Ignorant
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 15,613
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8186 Post(s)
Liked 9,098 Times
in
5,054 Posts
In Europe bike leasing is available and somewhat popular. Swapfiets is one such company, available in several countries.
https://swapfiets.co.uk/?_ga=2.10557...056.1657148933
https://swapfiets.co.uk/?_ga=2.10557...056.1657148933
That isn't really leasing a single bike, it's subscribing to a bike share service. Completely different model.
Similar arrangements have been tried with cars in the US, but they really don't seem to have done well,
Likes For livedarklions:
#29
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sin City, Nevada
Posts: 2,886
Bikes: Catrike 700, Greenspeed GTO trike, , Linear LWB recumbent, Haluzak Horizon SWB recumbent, Balance 450 MTB, Cannondale SM800 Beast of the East
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 523 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 229 Times
in
181 Posts
Lease = fleece?
People who give good financial advice often refer to a lease as a fleece. Car dealers love the idea as it allows them to "sell" a more expensive and profitable car or truck the buyer would never consider buying outright based on the monthly payments they could realistically afford. The dealer usually collects a pretty substantial upfront payment as well. At end of the lease you have no equity in the vehicle to apply as a down-payment for a new vehicle. If you go over the mileage limits you can get a big bill just to turn in the vehicle.
I had a neighbor who used to lease vehicles and turn them in after a few years. She always drove a newer vehicle than I did. The last time I remember her getting a new car she had to roll over a pretty hefty balance into the new lease just to get out of the old one. It's a vicious cycle where you end up paying more for the vehicle and never have any equity in what you are paying for.
I had a neighbor who used to lease vehicles and turn them in after a few years. She always drove a newer vehicle than I did. The last time I remember her getting a new car she had to roll over a pretty hefty balance into the new lease just to get out of the old one. It's a vicious cycle where you end up paying more for the vehicle and never have any equity in what you are paying for.
Likes For VegasTriker:
#30
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Far beyond the pale horizon.
Posts: 14,278
Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4260 Post(s)
Liked 1,362 Times
in
944 Posts
Anyway, it kind of depends what people mean by "lease". It's basically a synonym for "rent". You can certainly rent bicycles in the US but the cost of that doesn't make sense for anything long term.
I'm assuming the OP is talking about private (not business) "car leases" applied to bicycles.
#31
Senior Member
Their business model may not exactly fit your definition of leasing, but it definitely isn't "bike sharing". Swapfiets have a few options renting a bike. Either short term or 6 months minimum, leasing like terms. Where I live I see them every day. I even considered getting one myself, an e-bike, to try it out.
#32
Guest
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 2,888
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1346 Post(s)
Liked 3,270 Times
in
1,439 Posts
The mighty gatekeeper has spoken.
#34
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,949
Bikes: Colnago, Van Dessel, Factor, Cervelo, Ritchey
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3952 Post(s)
Liked 7,299 Times
in
2,947 Posts
#35
Guest
Join Date: Sep 2020
Posts: 2,888
Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1346 Post(s)
Liked 3,270 Times
in
1,439 Posts
Likes For Rolla:
#36
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2021
Posts: 4,083
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2333 Post(s)
Liked 2,097 Times
in
1,314 Posts
https://www.jobrad.org/
#38
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Mission Viejo
Posts: 5,806
Bikes: 1986 Cannondale SR400 (Flat bar commuter), 1988 Cannondale Criterium XTR, 1992 Serotta T-Max, 1995 Trek 970
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1944 Post(s)
Liked 2,164 Times
in
1,323 Posts
I didn’t follow all of the links, so this may already exist.
In a bike centric community where it is the primary method of transportation, I can see where leasing a bike can work. Obviously security is an issue, but I could see it as a niche industry.
Leasing a bike for just pleasure/fitness in a car centric environment probably has less of a chance to be successful since a bike is not essential.
John
In a bike centric community where it is the primary method of transportation, I can see where leasing a bike can work. Obviously security is an issue, but I could see it as a niche industry.
Leasing a bike for just pleasure/fitness in a car centric environment probably has less of a chance to be successful since a bike is not essential.
John
Likes For m.c.:
#40
Tragically Ignorant
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 15,613
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8186 Post(s)
Liked 9,098 Times
in
5,054 Posts
Their business model may not exactly fit your definition of leasing, but it definitely isn't "bike sharing". Swapfiets have a few options renting a bike. Either short term or 6 months minimum, leasing like terms. Where I live I see them every day. I even considered getting one myself, an e-bike, to try it out.
It's not MY definition of "leasing", it doesn't fit any reasonable definition of leasing. There's no lease. This is a month-to-month "membership" fee and if the bike stops being useable for any reason, they'll just swap bikes with you.
Real leases tie you into a specific vehicle over a much longer period than a month. If you know someone who got stuck ina lease of a crappy car, you'd spot the significant and real differences between this and leasing right away.
#41
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7,887
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6971 Post(s)
Liked 10,968 Times
in
4,692 Posts
This. It always makes me laugh when someone (usually an older male, full of wisdom) gives the advice to never borrow money for a new car. I could've paid cash for my last several cars, but always financed them. As long as the interest rate is below the S&P500's average annual rate of return, the car loan is a smart move. On our current vehicle we're paying 1.87% APR. Anyone who turns that down ought to have his head examined.
#42
Tragically Ignorant
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 15,613
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8186 Post(s)
Liked 9,098 Times
in
5,054 Posts
Quite right, all you said was that it existed. I'm skeptical that it will grow, but you just pointed to someone to watch to see if it will.
If it works, it won't fit my narrative of why it can't in the US, but I think I'll get over it.
Kayak guy will just go over and over it in circles until a mod tells him to knock it off.
#43
Tragically Ignorant
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 15,613
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8186 Post(s)
Liked 9,098 Times
in
5,054 Posts
Depends on the circumstances -- personal vs business use, etc. Also depends on timing -- e.g., I know several people whose leases ended during the past year or two, and were able to buy the vehicles (at the predetermined contract prices) and immediately flip them (to the same dealer) at very substantial profits because used cars were so scarce.
Not disagreeing with you, just think the example is maybe the best example of pure luck in timing possible.
#44
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7,887
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6971 Post(s)
Liked 10,968 Times
in
4,692 Posts
Even more broadly, we are all willing to pay for certain conveniences: flying business class vs coach, having someone else do your yardwork, going to a restaurant vs eating at home, etc...The list is infinitely long. Some people prefer to have a new car every few years, and a lease is an easy way to get that. If a person can afford it, why not? We all do things that make little financial sense to other observers, as we all have different preferences.
Likes For Koyote:
#45
Tragically Ignorant
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 15,613
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8186 Post(s)
Liked 9,098 Times
in
5,054 Posts
True, most definitely. But it supports my broader point, which is that blanket statements usually don't hold up very well.
Even more broadly, we are all willing to pay for certain conveniences: flying business class vs coach, having someone else do your yardwork, going to a restaurant vs eating at home, etc...The list is infinitely long. Some people prefer to have a new car every few years, and a lease is an easy way to get that. If a person can afford it, why not? We all do things that make little financial sense to other observers, as we all have different preferences.
Even more broadly, we are all willing to pay for certain conveniences: flying business class vs coach, having someone else do your yardwork, going to a restaurant vs eating at home, etc...The list is infinitely long. Some people prefer to have a new car every few years, and a lease is an easy way to get that. If a person can afford it, why not? We all do things that make little financial sense to other observers, as we all have different preferences.
If we were arguing, this would be the point where I'd tell you an anecdote about a car lease gone wrong.
I take your point also to be that such financial decisions are personal and situational, and no matter what they are, some element of luck is going to be involved as to how it works out.
I will make one blanket statement I think holds up very well--unless you're starting it yourself, don't go anywhere near a "multilevel marketing" scheme.
Likes For livedarklions:
#46
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 7,887
Mentioned: 38 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6971 Post(s)
Liked 10,968 Times
in
4,692 Posts
If we were arguing, this would be the point where I'd tell you an anecdote about a car lease gone wrong.
I take your point also to be that such financial decisions are personal and situational, and no matter what they are, some element of luck is going to be involved as to how it works out.
I will make one blanket statement I think holds up very well--unless you're starting it yourself, don't go anywhere near a "multilevel marketing" scheme.
I take your point also to be that such financial decisions are personal and situational, and no matter what they are, some element of luck is going to be involved as to how it works out.
I will make one blanket statement I think holds up very well--unless you're starting it yourself, don't go anywhere near a "multilevel marketing" scheme.
I'm not sure how a car lease can go wrong, since everything is spelled out in the contract. I have hear horror stories of people who went over the mileage limits and were charged big penalties, but that's all in a contract. (Disclaimer: I've never leased a car, so there may be aspects with which I'm unfamiliar.)
#47
Tragically Ignorant
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New England
Posts: 15,613
Bikes: Serotta Atlanta; 1994 Specialized Allez Pro; Giant OCR A1; SOMA Double Cross Disc; 2022 Allez Elite mit der SRAM
Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8186 Post(s)
Liked 9,098 Times
in
5,054 Posts
Agreed on the pyramid schemes...Though if you ARE at the top, they're great.
I'm not sure how a car lease can go wrong, since everything is spelled out in the contract. I have hear horror stories of people who went over the mileage limits and were charged big penalties, but that's all in a contract. (Disclaimer: I've never leased a car, so there may be aspects with which I'm unfamiliar.)
I'm not sure how a car lease can go wrong, since everything is spelled out in the contract. I have hear horror stories of people who went over the mileage limits and were charged big penalties, but that's all in a contract. (Disclaimer: I've never leased a car, so there may be aspects with which I'm unfamiliar.)
Well, for one thing, getting divorced in the middle of the term is not really in the contract.... I have a lot of clients who suddenly find the big SUV they're leasing ain't so great for that situation, especially if it's got mechanical issues.
#48
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Walnut Creek, CA
Posts: 760
Bikes: 1969 Peugeot PX10, 1992 Della Santa, Linus Roadster 8, Biria 700C ST-8
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 794 Post(s)
Liked 508 Times
in
322 Posts
It’s not really leasing but a lot of retailers are now offering POS financing. Especially online purchasers. When checking out the offer is given to make payments. I think this is really a bad idea for most people but isn’t that it in a nutshell?
#49
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Hacienda Hgts
Posts: 2,109
Bikes: 1999 Schwinn Peloton Ultegra 10, Kestrel RT-1000 Ultegra, Trek Marlin 6 Deore 29'er
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 822 Post(s)
Liked 1,961 Times
in
944 Posts
Coming soon: Repo Bikeman starring Emilio Estevez as an unemployed actor that has resorted to repo-ing expired lease Treks for $50 each.
Likes For CAT7RDR:
#50
I’m a little Surly
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near the district
Posts: 2,422
Bikes: Two Cross Checks, a Karate Monkey, a Disc Trucker, and a VO Randonneur
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 699 Post(s)
Liked 1,294 Times
in
647 Posts
If we're talking e-bike I think leasing is probably the next thing.