Redbullet

I was wondering whether I can find an application for smart trainer that can fulfill the following:
- Allows for riding in a pack and realistic drafting
- Accepts creating customized courses with scenery, either animated or from real movies
- Allows to create a cycling event and populate it with avatars of customized bots and real riders

I know that Wahoo RGT is one application that has those features, bit is there another one available on the market?

PeteHski

I think BKool has all those features, but I haven’t used it for a while. Rouvy has most of them too.

nicocyclo

Rouvy has almost all the requirements.
- Allows for riding in a pack and realistic drafting / yes, GR (group rides) meet this requirement here and drafting works great here.

- Accepts creating customized courses with scenery, either animated or from real movies / this is a bit different, routes can be recorded and then added to the ROUVY application, but they must be recorded with a 360 camera. This was also changed 2 months ago.

- Allows to create a cycling event and populate it with avatars of customized bots and real riders / this is possible in myrouvy, where you can create your own event and add anyone you want to ride with. You can also add bots there.

PeteHski

Are you sure Rouvy can generate animated scenery? I thought it could only use video or a 2D map.

Redbullet

Thanks.
I downloaded Bkool trial to understand how it works. I think it has a number of videos, which (if I correctly understood) can be also switched to "3D", or what I call "animated"
But I didn't find any section with bots. I used to ride a lot with customized bots, because it is almost impossible to find many friends with more or less the same training and who want to cycle exactly during the periods when I am available.
Or... does it have customizable bots and I didn't observe that setting?

PeteHski

Yes BKool can switch from video to generic animated 3D scenery. It actually works quite well. It can also generate 3D scenery from a user GPS route. It had bots available too when I was using it a couple of years ago. I seem to remember there were various types eg steady pacers or more aggressive racers. You could also add in ghost riders who had completed the course previously, ranked by their average W/kg.

Rouvy also has customisable bots available.

Eric F 

Although it misses the mark on the rest of your requests, one of my favorite features about Zwift is the variety of bot groups at different levels, covering different terrain, that can be joined at any time. The popularity of the platform tends to lead to spontaneous groups forming, as well.

unterhausen

The bots on zwift are pretty nice and easy to find in the new interface. I never used to look for them, probably because I don't wear my glasses down to the trainer.

PeteHski

Yeah, Zwift bots are a good feature for a paced group ride. After using pretty much all the major platforms, Zwift is still my favourite for group rides. The others are just too sparsely populated unless you can plan for specific group rides. Zwift you can just turn up any time and find a suitable group ride/race or join a pace-bot group.

Redbullet

I made a deep search on all tabs and screens in Bkool application, but I found nothing about bots. I think this feature is either well hidden or maybe discharged. I'll try to get some more info by directly asking them.

P.S.: Finally "nailed" it on their website:
"The option to include bots is no longer available, they have been temporarily removed so they will not be displayed. We are sorry for the inconvenience, they will be available again soon."

spelger

the bots are available in rouvy. think they are called ghost riders for that app. i tried it once but found them to be annoying so turned them off. what i do like is that i can add other riders that already did the course so i can sort of compete with them. i find that i ride harder when there is someone to chase or try to stay ahead of. what is tough is finding the right collection that are a bit better than me. kind of have to take a shotgun approach.

Redbullet

Yes, I have just tested them today. They stay in a some sort of pack and they ride hard until you drop. Then, they lower until you catch them and leave you to overtake. Then, they come back and hammer until they drop you again. They are annoying because there is no training concept behind their creation.

Redbullet

I have just evaluated Zwift with a free ride on “Tempus fugit”. I used Zwift 3 years until 2020, then I moved to another platform. I find now the same issue as years ago: there is no real drafting available. In fact, for me it is the opposite: around 75% of time I need 0 to 20% more W/Kg that the leading rider, in order to “draft” - not usual for an average rider of 78 kg. And even so, I’m pushed left, right or back at every 30 second or so. 3 years ago they told me that the big distance from my EU location to their servers creates a lag that makes drafting effect difficult. Another guy from help desk told me that drafting is successively available for a few riders at once in a crowd. Then, he said that he was wrong and that my connection to the sensors has too many drops. I see it is the same now, although connection to my sensors never dropped with other applications.
I would rather say that drafting is virtually not available, at least for those that are very far from Zwift servers. Funny enough, I am “on the hoods” when I input 20% more to “draft” somebody .

PeteHski

Drafting on Zwift can be a bit erratic for sure. Also I believe they deliberately reduce the draft effect to make breaks a bit easier in races. Then they introduced "double draft" for group rides to make the drafting more realistic. Although I haven't noticed that for a while. Maybe it's changed again. I'm lucky I can usually get a decent draft in Zwift, but it's far from perfect.

Redbullet

Yes, I remember that I always made a compromise with that: I easily renounced to claim that my final ranking might be lower than it should be. But usually I had to ride at 3-3.2 w/kg in the middle of 2.8 w/kg pack and sometimes I was not so strong to feed such difference, so I was losing the pack and the whole "social" experience. That's why I quit in 2020 and moved to a much more realistic application, that also offered wonderful customization of bots to simulate a pack. Now, that one was broken and I am trying to find another solution.