Flipped and slammed, now discomfort
09-03-12, 12:34 PM
#51
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It takes years to go from not riding much to a comfortable pro looking position unless you're a total freak in which case if you have to ask you aren't. The problem with noobs flipping and slamming the stem is that they usually don't realize they also need a longer stem and more setback, and when their back starts to hurt they can't figure out what's going on and don't / can't stick with the new position nearly long enough to get used to it. The right way to do it would be to have an idea what kind of position you want to end up with and work towards it, but if you are a noob you will have no idea what this position is so you should either just ride more and figure it out months or years down the road when you're actually fit, or get a coach or fitter to help you. Finally, many or most beginning cyclists are sitting on the bike wrong anyway which means even if they have the bike set up right it's probably not comfortable until the rider has the pelvis rotating and bent elbows epiphany.
09-03-12, 12:43 PM
#52
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Before getting on the warhorse, people should be reminded there are reasons besides vanity for lowering your position on the bike. Power production and aerodynamics come immediately to mind. Some can't get into the optimal position, but the ones who can didn't get there overnight. Large changes in position should be done over some time and you should always listen to your body. In general, muscle soreness is adaptable, tendon and joint pain is not.
On this forum, you'll find there are the stem flipping guys and the anti-stem flipping guys. Neither of these people are correct because neither are taking the utility of a road bike into account; just applying hard and fast rules because they can't think of anything else to do. The bike is somewhat adjustable and the body is somewhat adaptable. As long as you have muscle soreness and not joint or tendon pain, then you can adapt to the position in time. If you have joint or tendon pain, then you'll never adapt; you'll just convert discomfort into permanent injury. A higher position is generally better for comfort; a lower position is almost always better for aerodynamics and can many times be better for power production as well. Figure out what is important to you for your riding, and get yourself in the most suitable position; slowly and always listening to your body.
On this forum, you'll find there are the stem flipping guys and the anti-stem flipping guys. Neither of these people are correct because neither are taking the utility of a road bike into account; just applying hard and fast rules because they can't think of anything else to do. The bike is somewhat adjustable and the body is somewhat adaptable. As long as you have muscle soreness and not joint or tendon pain, then you can adapt to the position in time. If you have joint or tendon pain, then you'll never adapt; you'll just convert discomfort into permanent injury. A higher position is generally better for comfort; a lower position is almost always better for aerodynamics and can many times be better for power production as well. Figure out what is important to you for your riding, and get yourself in the most suitable position; slowly and always listening to your body.
Whole post excellent. Only make modifications if they are necessary. This, of course, means you need to determine what is necessary for you. The prevailing doctrine on this forum is not important. Be one of the people that ride their bike more than photograph it.
09-03-12, 01:38 PM
#53
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LOL.....raise the seat
09-03-12, 01:48 PM
#54
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What is the seat to handlebar drop? A flipped and slammed stem on some frames may only give 2" to 4" of drop which is well within the realms of a normal fit for a lot of people. On some frames it will be getting closer to 6"+ of drop which is too much for nearly everybody.
Also what is your saddle setback? It may need to be increased so that you can ride lower without the weight going on to your arms.
Also what is your saddle setback? It may need to be increased so that you can ride lower without the weight going on to your arms.
09-03-12, 01:52 PM
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First of all, there's this ^^^
Second, if you ever make adjustments to your fit on the bike, you should do so only a little bit at a time, no major adjustments all at once. If you have indeed done this, you have completely changed a fit that was working for you. Now you have shifted your weight, put strain on muscles that were not carrying that load prior, and of course you have going to experience some discomfort, at best. At worst, you will injure yourself.
Third:: You should know better than to listen to the idiots around here.
09-03-12, 01:59 PM
#56
Jet Jockey
As one poster already mentioned, the key to getting weight off the hands is to move the saddle back, changing the CG over the bottom bracket.
Now, on to "flipping and slamming".
My own handlebar setup was a slowly evolving process that took about a half a year. Started with the bars higher than I knew I would end up with, because, as you know, you can never put steerer back on, and it won't fix itself like a bad haircut.
Then, it was a matter of removing one 3mm or 5mm at a time, and riding for a while. Then I would cut, then try again. Eventually, I got down to a position that was great on my best day. After that, I added 5mm back on, because it won't always be my best day.
Interestingly enough, after arriving at my fit I found the entry on Dave Moulton's bike blog about saddle-to-bar drop, and took his numbers and went to the garage to measure my bike. Turns out I had arrived almost EXACTLY in the window he lists for a rider of my height. And, if my bike had a perfectly horizontal top-tube the way the bikes he references did, the tops of my bars would have been just as he described from the top of the bearing stack as well.
Now, on to "flipping and slamming".
My own handlebar setup was a slowly evolving process that took about a half a year. Started with the bars higher than I knew I would end up with, because, as you know, you can never put steerer back on, and it won't fix itself like a bad haircut.
Then, it was a matter of removing one 3mm or 5mm at a time, and riding for a while. Then I would cut, then try again. Eventually, I got down to a position that was great on my best day. After that, I added 5mm back on, because it won't always be my best day.
Interestingly enough, after arriving at my fit I found the entry on Dave Moulton's bike blog about saddle-to-bar drop, and took his numbers and went to the garage to measure my bike. Turns out I had arrived almost EXACTLY in the window he lists for a rider of my height. And, if my bike had a perfectly horizontal top-tube the way the bikes he references did, the tops of my bars would have been just as he described from the top of the bearing stack as well.
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Good night...and good luck
Good night...and good luck
09-03-12, 02:00 PM
#57
Jet Jockey
09-03-12, 03:13 PM
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What is the seat to handlebar drop? A flipped and slammed stem on some frames may only give 2" to 4" of drop which is well within the realms of a normal fit for a lot of people. On some frames it will be getting closer to 6"+ of drop which is too much for nearly everybody.
Also what is your saddle setback? It may need to be increased so that you can ride lower without the weight going on to your arms.
Also what is your saddle setback? It may need to be increased so that you can ride lower without the weight going on to your arms.
