Jerk Driver
07-24-09, 03:04 PM
#76
pan y agua
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^ Yeah Wikipedia is a great legal resource.
Even in the formulation that your are talking about, the Best evidence rule was used to prevent a witness from testifying as to the content of a document if the document itself was available.
Thus it originally related to the contents of documents.
Even in the formulation that your are talking about, the Best evidence rule was used to prevent a witness from testifying as to the content of a document if the document itself was available. Thus it originally related to the contents of documents.
__________________
You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
07-24-09, 03:06 PM
#77
Killing Rabbits
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^ Yeah Wikipedia is a great legal resource. Even in the formulation that you're talking about, the Best evidence rule was used to prevent a witness from testifying as to the content of a document if the document itself was available.
Thus it originally related to the contents of documents.
Even in the formulation that you're talking about, the Best evidence rule was used to prevent a witness from testifying as to the content of a document if the document itself was available. Thus it originally related to the contents of documents.
Last edited by Enthalpic; 07-24-09 at 03:18 PM.
07-24-09, 03:08 PM
#78
pan y agua
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And I was going to apologize for piling on, but then you posted again. I think we've beaten this horse enough now.
__________________
You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
07-24-09, 05:38 PM
#81
Watch This!
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Damn, I thought we were gonna have us barn burning, knee slapping, best evidence fight....
08-19-09, 09:29 PM
#83
Portland Fred
Just out of curiosity, do we know if the driver faced any consequences after the video was turned in?
08-19-09, 09:36 PM
#84
well hello there
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Inquiring minds need to know!
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Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.
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Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.
08-19-09, 10:12 PM
#85
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WTF? The Best Evidence rule relates to the admission of original documents as oppossed to copies, and typically copies are only excluded when there is a legitimate dispute over the contents of the original.
The only way the best evidence rule would have anything to do with this case is if the porsecutor was offering a copy of the Video into evidence, as oppossed to the original of the video.
The Best Evidence rule has nothing to do with a preference for video over eyewitness testimony in proving the occurrence of an event.
The "Best Evidence Rule" in Federal Courts is embodied in Federal Rule of Evidence 1003, Admissability of duplicates.
It simply states: A duplicate is admissable to the same extent of the original unless (1) a geniune issue is raised as to the authenticity of the original or (2) in the circumstances it would be unfair to admit the duplicate in lieu of the original.
It simply has no application to this discussion.
The only way the best evidence rule would have anything to do with this case is if the porsecutor was offering a copy of the Video into evidence, as oppossed to the original of the video.
The Best Evidence rule has nothing to do with a preference for video over eyewitness testimony in proving the occurrence of an event.
The "Best Evidence Rule" in Federal Courts is embodied in Federal Rule of Evidence 1003, Admissability of duplicates.
It simply states: A duplicate is admissable to the same extent of the original unless (1) a geniune issue is raised as to the authenticity of the original or (2) in the circumstances it would be unfair to admit the duplicate in lieu of the original.
It simply has no application to this discussion.
So like the suit said above, its about the original evidence and copies... Bottom line great job on catching the idiot in action. Maybe there is a civil angle... undo stress while riding thinking sooner or later he would hit you.
08-20-09, 12:07 AM
#87
Little Pony
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Oh god. This is still going on? Gave it to the police. Got a call from an officer about 2 weeks later.
<rant>
He said, oh, we could cite you for violations. I was like
I decided to leave that alone, given I know which battles to fight. Officer didn't exactly know what I do for a living and that I qualify as an expert witness on cycling. -not to mention the wife's qualifications- and we were in no way in violation of any laws. He mentioned that we were in violation of not riding in a bike lane. Double
There's no bike lane markings. No notice. Nothing demarcating it as a bike lane. He said that he talked to the city engineer and was told that it's a bike lane- that's unmarked. Whatever.
Being on friendly terms with the city engineer, I might send him a polite note.
</rant>
As far as the video is concerned, the officer said he'd forward it to the DA's office. Also knowing the DA, I'll shoot an e-mail over to find out if A. he got it and B. if he did, what the status is. Thanks for the reminder.
<rant>
He said, oh, we could cite you for violations. I was like
I decided to leave that alone, given I know which battles to fight. Officer didn't exactly know what I do for a living and that I qualify as an expert witness on cycling. -not to mention the wife's qualifications- and we were in no way in violation of any laws. He mentioned that we were in violation of not riding in a bike lane. Double There's no bike lane markings. No notice. Nothing demarcating it as a bike lane. He said that he talked to the city engineer and was told that it's a bike lane- that's unmarked. Whatever.
Being on friendly terms with the city engineer, I might send him a polite note.
</rant>
As far as the video is concerned, the officer said he'd forward it to the DA's office. Also knowing the DA, I'll shoot an e-mail over to find out if A. he got it and B. if he did, what the status is. Thanks for the reminder.
08-20-09, 05:11 AM
#89
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Cool. Talk about Instant Karma! Even if the DA can't use it to prosecute it would be great if they could take up his time/ resources in dealing with it. And I would also like to see the video when you can.
08-20-09, 05:18 AM
#90
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A couple of years ago my husband and I were riding on a narrow road with no bike lane but a great view. Most of the motorists are great and give up plenty of room when passing. But a truck with a boat on the trailer really buzzed us. Then again, when we got to the top of the next hill he was stopped at the bottom and smoke us coming from his transmission. A bit more instant karma than was probably warranted, but made for a smile as we passed him.
08-20-09, 07:34 AM
#91
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Sounds like you interrupted the cops coffee/donut break and required him/her to do actual work...ah well life can be rough.
08-20-09, 09:19 AM
#92
No matches
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Wow, the cop is an idiot. Not to mention, you don't have to ride in a bike lane even if there is one.
08-20-09, 09:33 AM
#93
Camo Shorts
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Before I became a cyclist, I did not appreciate how close was close. From my former perspective as a driver, I can accurately steer my car within an inch of parked car mirrors at speed so I had a similar outlook on bikes. I never came within an inch of a cyclist, of course, but probably a foot. Until I was actually riding in the street it was never impressed upon me how easily and quickly a cyclist can move out of a line or how often we may need to do this for debris, potholes, etc. Nor how much the wind from a car can jar us. In hindsight it is idiotically myopic not to realize these things, but I'm a smart and thoughtful guy who just never had the perspective back then. I'm sure plenty of people are in a similar situation, though plenty of people are jerks too.
08-20-09, 10:49 AM
#95
climber has-been
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Well, you do have to ride in the bike lane if you're in California. Unless you have a legal reason not to (avoiding obstacle, passing, turning, riding speed of traffic, etc.).
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08-20-09, 12:20 PM
#96
Little Pony
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Here ya go:
https://www.vholdr.com/node/41481
A couple quick notes before anyone comments.
the wife is a little ahead and right of me when the road widens.
the other vehicles give plenty of clearance.
the passenger side view mirror passed very close to my head.
there was no oncoming traffic and there was an unobstructed view of the road ahead.
the vehicle went ahead 50 meters, then slowed down to 20 mph, holding up 2 vehicles that had already passed us.
https://www.vholdr.com/node/41481
A couple quick notes before anyone comments.
the wife is a little ahead and right of me when the road widens.
the other vehicles give plenty of clearance.
the passenger side view mirror passed very close to my head.
there was no oncoming traffic and there was an unobstructed view of the road ahead.
the vehicle went ahead 50 meters, then slowed down to 20 mph, holding up 2 vehicles that had already passed us.
08-20-09, 12:24 PM
#97
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looks like you were in the wrong..
I mean you were riding a bike.. on a road.. thats meant for cars and trucks.. so what did you expect?
ps.. awesome setup on the vid camera!
I mean you were riding a bike.. on a road.. thats meant for cars and trucks.. so what did you expect?
ps.. awesome setup on the vid camera!
08-20-09, 12:36 PM
#98
Little Pony
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Before I became a cyclist, I did not appreciate how close was close. From my former perspective as a driver, I can accurately steer my car within an inch of parked car mirrors at speed so I had a similar outlook on bikes. I never came within an inch of a cyclist, of course, but probably a foot. Until I was actually riding in the street it was never impressed upon me how easily and quickly a cyclist can move out of a line or how often we may need to do this for debris, potholes, etc. Nor how much the wind from a car can jar us. In hindsight it is idiotically myopic not to realize these things, but I'm a smart and thoughtful guy who just never had the perspective back then. I'm sure plenty of people are in a similar situation, though plenty of people are jerks too.
Edit: I also just checked- there's no such thing as an "unmarked" bike lane. " 'Bicycle lane' means that part of the highway, adjacent to the roadway, designated by official signs or markings for use by persons riding bicycles except as otherwise specifically provided by law." I just sent a note off to the city traffic engineer.
Thanks!
Last edited by obra3; 08-20-09 at 01:07 PM.
08-20-09, 09:48 PM
#99
well hello there
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Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.
08-21-09, 05:50 AM
#100
Portland Fred
He said, oh, we could cite you for violations. I was like I decided to leave that alone, given I know which battles to fight. Officer didn't exactly know what I do for a living and that I qualify as an expert witness on cycling. -not to mention the wife's qualifications- and we were in no way in violation of any laws. He mentioned that we were in violation of not riding in a bike lane. Double
I decided to leave that alone, given I know which battles to fight. Officer didn't exactly know what I do for a living and that I qualify as an expert witness on cycling. -not to mention the wife's qualifications- and we were in no way in violation of any laws. He mentioned that we were in violation of not riding in a bike lane. Double Curiously, NONE of this advice has ever been correct. And strangely, none of the people seem familiar/concerned with the safe passing law despite the fact it received a lot of publicity and their made up laws have not.