Happy Feet

A recent thread had me asking about some unintended consequences surrounding the practice of flipping. As I said there, I'm not against it but wondered about the effects of buying out reasonably priced transport in a market only to resell it at a profit. I'm not really concerned about people with disposable income looking for a Hipster bike, and those who collect to collect probably seek out certain specific models. What I think about is the aggressive flipper in a limited market who might scoop up many bikes that need little or no refurbishment to be road worthy; the sort of bikes lower income people might also be seeking for basic needs, or driving up the overall price of bikes by encouraging others who look to the market to see how they to should price.

Some say let the market decide, but if we think of buying used bicycles from a socio economic perspective, usually a practice conducted by those of limited means, driving up the market by flipping or acting like "Storage Wars" participants creates a barrier for some. Basically becoming a professional "middle man" in a used market.

It's not like I'm a hard core Marxist Leninist either... it was just something that struck me as I perused the CL listings and saw so many ridiculously priced basic 10 speed road bikes.

Some interesting comments ensued in the other thread but what intrigued me were the comments by some who said they flipped but also recognized the need for reasonable transportation for lower income people by contributing to Bike Co-ops or thrift stores. We don't have a Co-op close by but I try to do the same thing. I like to wrench a bit and bring junk bikes back from the brink but I can't really keep a bunch of the same sort of bikes so I list them for a while at a reasonable price and then send them off to the thrift store if they don't move.

Another person said they fix bikes that are too small or not their "style" to keep from giving into the hoarder bug which I also thought was a great idea.

Anyone else paying it forward in some way while still getting enjoyment from the hobby.

fender1

People looking for cheap transport by bikes at Target/ Wal-Mart. Hobbyists/flippers peruse CL looking for bargains. I just give stuff I don't need or want to bother selling, to the local co-op. They can use it or make some $$ recycling it. Its just a bunch of old bike crap given undue importance because of an internet forum. Go for a ride and stop worrying so much.

eschlwc

i live in a hot market and feel that fully refurbishing mid-level bikes and marketing them with great service at a fair price ($400ish) is "paying it forward." it allows me to keep going in more ways than one. and when a newbie gets one of my perfect bikes, i'm aiming to convert him for life. it actually seems cheap to me.

there are plenty of lower level and lower mid-level bikes out there priced under $200 for those with different needs.

66Satellite

Depending on where you live there is a decent chance that there is a non-profit bike shop near you that has youth programs, etc. When I lived in SF it was Pedal Revolution. Now in Seattle for me it's Bike Works.

San Francisco - Bike Shop, Womens Bike, Used Bikes | Bicycles for Sale at Pedal Revolution - SF, CA California Bay Area

Welcome to Bike Works - Bike Works

Last week I gave Bike Works a Surly Cross Check frame (commuted on it for ten years--got my money's worth) and an On-One Pompino frame (finally realized I would never build the thing up and I was sick of looking at it) along with a bunch of XT parts I'd pulled off a Bontrager I scored on Craigslist. Goes to a good cause, I get a tax writeoff and don't have to deal with Craigslist flakes or shipping anything.

scozim 

I have had 3-4 bikes that haven't fit me in the past few years or were just frames. I've built them up or refurbished if a complete bike and given them a way to people I know who 1) had a need and 2) didn't have a lot of money to buy one. Two of them I know for sure are still riding and enjoying the bikes which has made it all worth it.

clubman 

I like the random, spontaneous giving of a part, a bike or service. A girl passed our house, walking a sleeper old school Marinoni with drooping chain. Asking whats wrong, she points out the broken Ofmega front derailleur. Run down the stairs and come back with a couple of tools, swap in an identical (white body?) gear and a new cable. Told me she'd just left the LBS who wanted her to put something ugly on as replacement but left empty handed and met me minutes later. .5 minutes of PIF that made her so happy was priceless. It's nice to stumble into those moments.

thinktubes 

+1

Velocivixen

Well, I recently donated some stuff & sold a frame cheap to a local forum member who himself is making up a nice bike to give to another. I don't know, nor will ever know the recipient, but I feel good about moving some things along....just because I liked the cause.

I like to pay it forward because many have been kind to me. Just a couple of days ago I went to my local bike shop and asked if they had any down tube cable stops for a bike with down tube braze ons (I moved my downtube shifters up to thumb mounts). Anyways, one of the older mechanics looked around in back then came out with new, never opened set of Shimano STI down tube stops and said, "they're a gift". I still bought something since I came for more than the cable stops, but it was kind that he gave those to me. Just out of curiosity I looked online and they sell for around $26 give or take. I'm a good customer there and they like that I enjoy bikes.

Happy Feet

Great posts.
Hey, I commute an hour a day and worry very little. Doing that and thinking are not mutually exclusive exercises however.

I wish there was a coop near me. I work with seniors though and one thing I'm looking at is adding bicycle wrenching to our mens oriented programming. We do woodworking already and bike mechanics is safe enough for liability issues etc... I'm also cleaning out my garage a bit so my son and his extended group of friends can work on their bikes, mostly downhills and BMX. He told me today that it was sightly embarrassing that I knew more about fixing bikes than him. Dude, I've been a kid for like 50 years already.

I don't really want to argue the pros and cons of flipping so much - it was just an observation. I'm far more interested in positive tangents people take with the hobby.

sloar 

Closest bike shop is about an hour drive, I'm basically the towns bike repair guy. Most simple adjustments are free of charge. Usually the only time I charge is if i have to pay for a replacement part. People almost always pay me something though.

Lascauxcaveman 

A couple of years ago, I placed a want ad for "free bikes and bike parts" on CL explaining that I liked to tinker with bikes, refurbish them and give them away and/or sell them for the cost of new parts I put on them. I thought it would be a good way to practice wrenching and learn a little bit about it.

Over the next year, I got almost two dozen bikes from that one ad, and did what I said. Even many months after the original ad wasn't up anymore, because I also gave the finished bikes away on CL. I had to stop after my own personal projects crowded my shop. I might do it again, if I ever catch up with the backlog of projects I have going now.

You could do the same, if you feel like "paying it forward."

randyjawa 

I built This to help others. I have helped to salvage 10,000+ bikes, most of which were sent to Africa. And I try my best to answer every request for information/help that comes to me through my website every day. That is paying it forward in my book...

CliffordK

The entire capitalist retail market is about buying something, marking it up, and reselling it. What about all of those stores that buy the parts, or bicycles, and add a 100% markup on them for resale. And, then complain about competition with a better selection and lower markups.

My goal is to start adding some quality bikes into the local market at a reasonable price, rather than pulling them out of the market. Anything I sell will be with a full tune-up, rebuild, or scratch build.

RubberLegs

I "DO TIME" at our local Bike CoOp, several hours a week, the clientele varies greatly, from punk kids on fixies, to young urban professionals, to retirees on fixed incomes to the homeless and their only transport...Have worked on some cool old bikes, and worked on lots of Walmart clunkers....bet we try and get and keep people rolling, on whatever they ride.

mstateglfr 

I really like getting unusable bikes back on the road. It just happens that what I can find in my area which is fixable and still good enough to command prices to allow me to keep going without taking a loss are entry level and mid-level road bikes from the 80s/early 90s, as well as mtbs and hybrids from that same era.
I fully refurbish the bikes and sell them for a profit, but its still below what many listings are asking for similar bikes that haven't been fixed up. I want people to enjoy riding and also want the bikes to get out of my garage once they are finished. I will never get rich off this, so why hold off for months and months waiting to get that extra $25? It doesn't make sense to me, given my situation and setup.
I buy from and at times volunteer at the local bicycle collective and their pricing is both higher than mine and its often times for bikes in worse cosmetic and/or mechanical condition. I donated a bike a few weeks ago after having it listed on CL for a bit and they priced it higher than I listed it for. Good by me- I get a tax donation slip and they get $ from a fully refurbished bike they didn't spend time on.
I will at times buy bikes with the intention of refurbishing them for donation to the local collective. Ive let the sellers know what I want to do and a few of them have agreed to my $ offer because of whats going to happen to the bike. I may be out $50 once the bike is fully refurbished and has new consumables where needed, but its worth plenty more than that once donated and I get a donation slip. For me, that's basically the same as selling it and I count it as such in my spreadsheet of bikes and costs.

3speedslow

I am handing out parts and frames to the locals I know when the need shows itself. I ask nothing but a hand shake and like the feeling of giving. I have fixed or given directions for others bikes when I can.

Sometimes I will loan parts to some so they can continue riding while they save or look for a replacement part ie wheels.

I have enough stuff to keep my fleet going and more to help with future projects waiting. I am on fixed income now but still want to share this great bicycle life with others when I can.

It makes good sense.

oddjob2

The takeoff components that I do not expect to reuse such as cables, tires, tubes, chains, steel handlebars, grips, saddles, pedals, rims, framesets, etc., all go to the Hub of Detroit, thinking they will be incorporated into the bikes they keep on the road for kids and those in needs. The Hub gives nothing away, although they have on rare occasion removed a freewheel for me gratis if I brought the tool, before I got my own big honking bench vise.

However, I have found that the frames I have donated which are cosmetic nightmares, but generally rust free, end up being rebuilt of new and old components and on the sales floor for top dollar. Frames I donated including a brown Centurion Lemans and a Bridgestone MB-5, were for sale as complete bikes for $350-$400, about double what I would expect they would fetch as complete bikes. Someone was buying them, because they'd be gone with 4-6 weeks.

Neighbors and friends have received:
- refurbished bikes as gifts
- gratis repairs and parts
- better bikes at my direct cost

I sell a fair number of low end steel wheeled 10 speeds, hybrids, and mixtes (no electro forged Schwinns), in the sub $200 level, which were acquired in unrideable condition and have been comprehensively refurbished by me with new consumables. At that price point, a LBS charges that much just for the overhaul labor not including parts and cleaning, so if it weren't for hobbyists like me, these bikes would be junked or demise more rapidly.

RobbieTunes

Sure. I'd not be surprised if most of us do. Everyone I've come across on this forum is generally more generous than we let on. Meeting them in person just confirms that. We're not special, just human.

jyl

I give away bikes sometimes. Five in the last couple years. I always include a U lock and sometimes a helmet.

A Dahon folding bike and U lock got shipped to a young lady in NYC where @noglider generously assembled and tuned it (after loaning her one of his bikes for a year!). A Hardrock mountain bike was set up with fenders, lights, and road tires, U lock and lights and given to another young lady as her Portland commuter. My son's old Trek was tuned up and given, with lights, U lock and helmet, to one of his classmates whose family couldn't afford a good bike. His other old Trek was given to that girl's brother. A vintage lugged 48 cm Trek frame went to a woman whose Craigslist bike was very nice but too large for her; I transferred over the components (all vintage Campagnolo) and added fenders.

I currently have two more bikes in the queue to be fixed up and given away. These are small, kid's bikes.

Sometimes I work on bikes for people. I'm sort of the regular bike mechanic for a couple of them. I fix their bikes with parts from my pile, charge them the cost of whatever other parts I have to buy. Their bikes don't look like much, but ride great - perfect sleeper commuter bikes for Portland.

Another friend uses my tools. He's building a bike for his wife and will probably use some rims and other parts from my pile.

What goes around, comes around. Other people have generously given me parts, wheels, help. @Velocivixen, @nazcalines and others are helping me build a bike to be given to a high school girl (see other thread), hopefully she'll get it in a week. A buddy who isn't on BF has given me rims and other parts before.

Bike stuff is not, usually, worth too much. Selling bits and pieces on CL is a big hassle and yields little. With a few hours of time, those pieces can be assembled into a solid bike for someone who otherwise would have no bike, or a CL bike that needs $150 of LBS work to run right. Even quite humble bikes, if well adjusted, lubed, wheels trued, brakes fixed, become magic carpets.

noglider 

I've hoarded much too much stuff over recent years, often thinking, "Ooh, that will come in handy one day." The result is, as I said, much too much stuff. Now I'm giving away some for the price of shipping and selling a little of it. I've been collecting it for donations to a coop, too. I suspect I'll be happier when I can see all my stuff at a glance. I'm working towards it and making progress.

I considered selling that old Raleigh Super Course that I loaned to @jyl's friend, but I'm glad I didn't. It's now my off-road bike. I rode it this past Saturday and still adore it.

Drillium Dude 

I inadvertently "paid it forward" to a number of Ebay vintage bike enthusiasts when I sold the Olympia and the new owner (I give him that moniker with a fat tongue in cheek) turned 'round and immediately parted it out

The takeaway? Part 'em out myself - unless I'm selling to someone here. I trust you peeps

DD

scozim 

Yeah that's too bad. But you've also been more than generous to me and I'm sure many other forum members.