ginacico

I searched and found this thread, which came close to answering my questions.

https://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-me...onversion.html

My road bike (2001 Univega Modo Volare) came with a full Daytona groupo, including a double 53/39 in the front. Can I switch it to a triple and get more climbing power?

Here are what I think are the relevant components.

Front chainring: Daytona 53/39 double
Rear cassette: Centaur 10 speed 13-29 (I've already swapped out the original Daytona 10s 12-25)
Rear derailleur: Daytona short cage
Shifters: Daytona Ergopower

My question is, will the rear D and shifters be compatible, and is this a simple swap of the chainring? And what are my choices for triples?

Hoping to do this without a massive overhaul, but would like it to result in that smooth, precise Campagnolo feel.

Homebrew01

I think you will need:
new crankset and bottom bracket
new front derailleur to handle the range of the 3 rings.
The left shifter might be fine, if it pulls enough cable for 3 rings, and is not "indexed" for 2 chainrngs.
You might need a longer cage rear derailleur to take up the extra chain when on the small front ring and smaller cogs.
No expert, just tossing thoughts out there to consider.

Would switching to a compact double 50-34 get you a low enough gear ?? Much simpler to do.

Drew Eckhardt 

Your left shifter will run a triple. You can use a triplizer 39 ring with your existing crank, but will need a longer bottom bracket for it to clear and it won't shift as well as a quality triple middle ring.



https://www.ebay.com/itm/Willow-Tripl...-/181861678134

The double front derailleur may or may not not shift it reliably. The short cage rear will be slack with smaller cogs.

I run 2010 Ultrashift levers, 2004-2006 Record Titanium triple front and long cage rear derailleurs, and an FSA SLK-Light crank although there are lots of options with varying price points and aesthetics.

Ideally you want a long cage Campagnolo 10 speed rear derailleur to get enough wrap for the 13-29 with a triple. That can vary from inexpensive to NOS Record titanium. Derailleurs from 2010 and before are preferred for better shift reliability because Campagnolo switched to weaker springs on derailleurs intended for use with the PowerShift escapement mechanisms. IIRC 2007-2008 Veloce and below are less desirable for that reason too.



Ideally you want a triple front derailleur. A plethora of options exist from inexpensive steel to Record titanium with coated alloy cage and titanium clamp bolts.



You can run any triple crank you want. Campagnolo and Shimano shift best.

A used Record hidden arm crank off ebay would be period correct and about as sexy as triple cranks get.



Campagnolo makes or made silver PowerTorque hollow-spindle triple cranks which look OK although some people don't like that bottom bracket system


FSA made 24mm spindle carbon triples with solid (SLK) and hollow (SLK-Light) crank arms which are affordable on the used market. This one is a solid arm SLK although I now run a SLK-Light. You can get them in 53-39-30 or 50-39-30.



Lightning makes a very nice 30mm spindle carbon crank with a triple spider option for $680 without rings (no, it does not include a power meter for that price).

All of those are road triples with 74mm inner BCDs which take small rings down to 24T. Campagnolo uses 135mm BCD outer and middle rings for which there are fewer aftermarket options; the rest are 130mm BCD.

You'll also need a new bottom bracket which pairs the crank of your choice with a BSA shell.

ginacico

Huge thanks for all the clues!

I considered a compact double, but think I'm game for more of an overhaul for the flexibility the triple will provide. It's an old bike with a fortysomething rider who wants to keep doing this a long time to come. When I bought the bike new in 2001, the other two models had triples, but this was the only one left in my frame size. I couldn't turn down the screamer deal (end of season, discontinued models). But it came with a racing double and I always figured I'd contemplate a conversion someday. Last weekend we rode a century with one or two hills that made me think, y'know, maybe now's the time.

Drew, the logic makes sense for what I need to replace, and I appreciate the great list of options. I'm already EBay shopping and have found lots of period correct and/or appealing components, which I'm going to start gathering. Once I've got the pile o' parts, maybe I'll let my LBS do the parts swap just to make sure it all fits and gets tuned correctly.

Not sure why, I'm just kinda attached to her. Thanks again!

ginacico

I'm back, and I've been shopping for Campy components. Although finding a "matched set" of period-appropriate parts is next to impossible, I found things that hopefully work together aesthetically and don't break the bank.

Can anyone comment on whether they'll work together mechanically? All advice welcomed, I'd appreciate any input before I start bidding.

My plan is to collect the pieces, then have my LBS do the conversion and tune-up.



Triple crankset: Campagnolo Centaur Triple Road Bike Crankset 170mm 52/42/30t
Campagnolo Centaur Triple Road Bike Crankset 170mm 52 42 30T ISO Taper 135 74BCD | eBay

(Plus a compatible bottom bracket.)



Triple front derailleurs:

Daytona triple front derailleur
Campagnolo Daytona Triple Front Derailleur Mech VGC Chorus Record Compatible | eBay



- OR -

Record Triple Front Derailleur braze-on
Campagnolo Record Triple Front Derailleurs Braze On | eBay



Rear derailleur: NOS Vintage CAMPAGNOLO Italy CENTAUR LONG CAGE Rear Derailleur NEW 80s (OB)
NOS Vintage CAMPAGNOLO Italy CENTAUR LONG CAGE Rear Derailleur NEW 80s (OB)

Al1943

Do you know what bottom bracket spindle length you need? I may have available what you need, slightly used by my wife, on a Campy triple.

ginacico

In short, I'm not quite sure yet. I think it has a 102mm spindle currently, but I don't know whether that will change with a triple crank?

Drew Eckhardt 

The 1980s Centaur mountain bike rear derailleur won't because Campagnolo changed the actuation ratio from 1.4 to 1.5 with the move from 9 speeds to 10. You need a post-2000 derailleur identifiable by the adjustment mechanism on the lower pivot instead of the traditional B-tension screw.

Campagnolo 9 speed is 1mm wider than 8; 10 speed is wider still with the big cog offset to sit inboard of the spline-ends.

Either the shifters needed to grow with bigger cable drums, or the ratio needed to increase for more movement with the existing drum size. They chose the later.

Tangentially, that "Record" front derailleur still has a steel fork and hardware like much less expensive units. You'd be paying a lot just for the name.

Drew Eckhardt 

28.6mm seat tubes require a 111mm symmetrical bottom bracket, 32 and 35 require a 115.5mm spindle.

D1andonlyDman

FYI, on my Paramount PDG Series 7 build (28.6 seat tube), I started out with a Campy Record 135mm Bcd crank bought cheap on on ebay with badly worn out chainrings (Chorus and Veloce will also work), and then replaced all three rings with the Willow tripleizer chainring set linked below (now it's a 51-39-29 - the seller swapped the 49 for a 51 at no additional charge at my request). With that setup, I found that a 112mm symmetrical sealed BB works great. I'm using Shimano 9 speed gearing, with a 5703 front derailleur, and Shimano Dura Ace 9-speed downtube shifters that are index shifters in the back, and friction shifters in the front. Once I got everything adjusted, shifting works great, front and back.

Triplizer Chainring Set 49 39 29 Triple Cranks Campy Campagnolo 135 BCD | eBay

fietsbob

I Think the mid priced, [Sub Record] Triples and the doubles used a re designed Right arm so as to Share the same square taper cartridge BB .

My 'Race' Triple is on a symmetrical 111.. have an extra Ital 115, but didnt need it with a standard seat tube Diameter. (sell?)

Isnt the RD is from their long closed out MTB parts line?

Al1943

The Campy BB I have has a 115.5 mm square taper spindle. It was lightly used on a Trek 5200 cf frame with a Campy Racing triple. The cup threads are British standard. The frame tube size is important, see Drew's post regarding tube size.

ginacico

Y'see, this is exactly why I asked - thanks!

Does this work? I was told a medium cage might also suffice, but I can't really find anything of that vintage at the moment.

Rear D: New 2008 Campagnolo Record Titanium 10 Speed Long Cage Rear Derailleur RD4-REXL
New 2008 Campagnolo Record Titanium 10 Speed Long Cage Rear Derailleur RD4 Rexl | eBay


I went ahead and got these. They were the least expensive options I could find that were close to the original aesthetics of the bike (which came with Daytona).

Triple crankset: Campagnolo Centaur Triple Road Bike Crankset 170mm 52/42/30t
Campagnolo Centaur Triple Road Bike Crankset 170mm 52 42 30T ISO Taper 135 74BCD | eBay

Front D: Daytona triple front derailleur
Campagnolo Daytona Triple Front Derailleur Mech VGC Chorus Record Compatible | eBay


The seatpost on the bike is 27.2mm. Though I have no means to accurately measure the seat tube, eyeing it with a ruler it sure looks like a size 28.6mm. No way it's over 30.

So with that, and the Centaur triple crankset, what bottom bracket would I need?

Drew Eckhardt 

It'll work great.


Should be the 111.

ginacico

I sent the parts list to my LBS, who approves wholeheartedly.

Their additional recommendations included checking the rear cassette, which might have some wear (it was installed in 2010, so it's newer than the other components). And to consider a flush/regrease of the bearings in the wheels and headset; not a bad idea for a 15-year-old bike.

Thank you Drew and all for the suggestions and advice. It'll take awhile to get all the parts in and do the conversion, but once it's done I'll report back!