BDM

Just retired our 20-year-old Burley Duet and I'm looking for a replacement for credit card touring and recreational rides. I'm looking at bikes with 20" wheels - ie Bike Friday and Circe Helios. I would be interested in hearing how people find these bikes in terms of comfort, performance, load-carrying ability. My wife and I have been very comfortable on the Burley. We've had some great tours, many 160 km days (not so much now that I'm in my 70's) and lots of recreational rides. I'm looking for a tandem that will be easier to pack in the car and easier to lug through airports, but it must be fun to ride. Any suggestions?

StephenH

Can't really help with the question, but I will point out that you can get full-size bikes with couplers, and also I see that Ritchey makes a tandem Breakaway bike. Tandem Travel Bikes | Break-Away | Ritchey.

qspencer

I had a Bike Friday for 5 years and sold it last year. When I bought it, the primary motivations were transportability and the ability to fit very short stokers. Comfort was fine, almost too good: as my 4 year old stoker became a 9 year old stoker, I started to notice the high flex in the frame whenever he started making a serious effort to pedal. We ended doing almost all of our riding from home, so I rarely ever took the bike apart. One time last summer I only partially disassembled it for a short car trip on a hitch mount rack. It took long enough to put it back together that the rest of the family got pretty bored and impatient. I decided it was time for a full size frame since both of my potential stokers are now tall enough. If packing it in a suitcase is important, the pain of disassembly and reassembly may be worth it, but I'd suggest doing some research on how involved that is for different systems. I suspect the S+S couplers are probably easier and faster than the Bike Friday system.

fxsvelo

I think the Fridays were an option before we had coupled bikes. Given all the compromises that Fridays are stuck with, I think coupled bikes are a much better option. I would certainly give a tandem a good test ride to see if it works for you. We tried a used one that was for sale and pretty much immediately rejected it as an option. Even went to the trouble of getting better tires to see if that would help.

On the overseas trips I've been on, there tend to be more ex-Friday owners these days. Last trip in Italy, the Friday tandem had a broken part from shipping it. They tell you that they'll ship these odd parts anywhere in the world, and that's true but it was $60 to ship a $5 part and get it in 3 days. Fortunately they were able to ride in low gear for a few days until the part arrived.

And speaking of non-standard stuff, my ex and both had Friday singles. She still has hers. One side of the take-apart handlebar snapped off as she lifted the front end over that little bump to go into a driveway. Called Green Gear and they said, "Yeah, that happens. You need to buy new bars. Oh, and replace the bars if you see any bulges starting to form." Gee thanks for the support on that.

ksisler

Overall, coupled bikes are cool to have / ride / transport. They are however mighty tuff to buy...Can we say spendy!!

But it is not a fault of the builders as the parts and labor to produce one are significant.

chris ss

BDM - welcome + glad you posted the question. Our situation is similar in some ways + we're beginning to look think + talk about a new tandem for credit card touring as well.

I don't mean to hijack the thread + if it's better to start a new one please say so + I'll do so.

We're leaning towards a coupled frame + 650B wheels for rideability, altho the transportability of 20" wheels is certainly attractive.

Seems to me that a 24" wheel is a real interesting compromise. I know Tern ternbicycles.com makes 24" singles. I know the parts supply for hi-quality 24" wheels (rims, spokes, tires, tubes) is thin so that's certainly a deterrent. But in terms of pure size, that seems like a real interesting size that would potentially offer a very nice point on the "ride vs fold" spectrum. I'd appreciate hearing from anybody who's had any experience with riding or parts availability for these. And especially if anybody knows of any sources for 24" tandem frames, straight or folding.

chojn1

We bought a set of 650B wheels for transport with our coupled tandem. We liked the ride so much that we never bother putting the 700c set back on. We also have a set of 26" but will put up with packing of the 650B for the noticeably better road ride.
With the internet I don't think you will have any problem finding parts for what ever wheel size you choose. You just have to plan ahead and stock back up parts.
If you are a light team, you may also want to spec your frame with 135mm rear spacing. That will save a little extra width space in your luggage and makes finding wheels a lot easier.

fietsbob

I'm Ok with my Bike Friday , But I'm single .. their Heavy Rider option A large diameter tube triangle,

uses the building Jigs for their tandems captain's section. .

With the front Rack & Panniers on it, the steering stability is fine.

the weight helps the low Trail Geometry, the low trail geometry is what Porteur Bikes adopted to carry their weight.


Cane creek Thudbuster seat posts are excellent.. get 2.

chris ss

Thx for the tip... what's the difference that makes the 650B's harder to pack + so much better ride? I always thought of them as pretty similar to 26".

And thx for that too, that had not occurred to me but is a great thought.

chojn1

For touring bikes, the largest wheel with the widest tires that you can fit is the most comfortable ride.
They just ride over bumps better. Tire width of the 700c is limited by the chainstay and fork width. Using wide 38mm tires makes the 650B feels like the 700c on narrow tires. There is also and added advantage of not having to worry about small ruts or cracks in the roads

For airline travel, your wheel case need to be less than 62 linear inch to avoid oversize luggage charge. 700c wheels are always a struggle, but the 650B wheels fits easily into my case with the tires on.

I see no advantage of the 26" or smaller wheels except for ultra light packing or if they are dictated by the geometry of your frame.

fxsvelo

Agreed. The 650B wheel with fatter tires has the same overall outside tire diameter as a 700c wheel with a skinny tire, so the gearing and geometry is the same. That was the whole point of 650B. That's why the Ritchey tandem makes sense as a 700c or 650b wheel bike. Same geometry and gearing for both wheel sizes. So add in the benefits of the smaller rim diameter, more choices in fatter tires, same bump/tire diameter factor as 700c, and 650B looks like a good bet for a travel tandem.

We're considering a Ritchey for a travel tandem, but my wife doesn't like the color scheme. I think Ritchey imports the frame unpainted so you could get custom paint. I'd do powder coat for a travel bike.

Oh, and if you use 650b wheels you can forget the suspension post.

BDM

Not too many words of support for Bike Friday. I'm still intrigued by the Circe Helios but it's hard to get an objective review.

geoffs

We were on a big NSW bike ride quite a few years ago riding our Co-motion Mocha co-pilot. The roads were pretty average to say the least and on one long bumpy downhill I kept the speed down to 70kmh and the bike felt pretty comfortable thple thatrough the corners. There were a few other tandems with either 26' or 700c wheels that we spoke to had been about the same speed.
When we spoke to the people that were riding bike Tuesdays they had kept the speed down to 45kms and they felt nervous at that speed. So I gathered from that that the larger diameter wheels are more stable through bumpy corners than 20" wheels.
Our Mocha has done a lot of airmiles without any problems.
I have always suffered from that serious cycling disease "upgraditis" and am currently looking at one of these Paketa Magnesium Tandem Bicycle:: R2 performance touring tandem::lightweight touring tandem