hhnngg1

I just wasted 2 hours of my life redoing the cabling on my Tiagra 4700 (current-gen).

Just mentioning this so you don't do the same thing:

- I ran the cable the WRONG way through the FD bolt. Apparently it makes a huge difference if you go to the right of the bolt or to the left of the bolt before you tighten it down. Drove me nuts because I'd get everything to shift perfectly, perfect cable tension, and then after 10 or 15 test shifts, it would suddenly stop shifting. A lot tougher to troubleshoot than if it just never worked in the first place.

tyrion

Not a waste. A learning experience. Grasshopper.

Aubergine 

That is the same thing with all indexed derailleurs. I learned that lesson years ago when Campy Ergos came out. When I work on customer bikes these days I always always tell them that too, so they can do it right themselves.

TimothyH

Shimano Manuals & Tech Docs


-Tim-

redlude97

Does the 4700 use the alignment bracket to determine the pin position like on the new 11 speed fds? Yes reading the tech sheet was important for the new groupsets. Things like proper ferrule use etc explained helped get things dialed fast

sunburst

Two hours and you've got a working bike? That's a good result compared to some of my wrenching misadventures.

hhnngg1

Two hours for a simple FD recabling job is ridiculous by any standard! Especially if you've done it succesfully 4x in the past!

TimothyH

The Dealer Manual shows exactly how it is supposed to go.
See page 14.

All Shimano tech docs are at https://si.shimano.com


-Tim-

maddog34

no one is perfect... glad to hear you got it sorted out...

EnsitMike

Dang I had no idea that was a thing… glad I read this because that is one of those things I’d never check.

That said… Di2 or e-Tap

jorglueke

Thanks for sharing.

srestrepo

I spent $150 bucks on new shifters because my Sora front derailleur always had either too much tension and was super hard to shift or was out of adjustment. I had the Sora road bike shifter than ran the shifting cables NOT under the bar tape so I upgraded to the new shifters that do run under the bar tape. It was then that I realized I was just reinstalling the cable in the wrong side of the bolt simply because that's how it came from the bike shop...

Oh well, now my commuter looks and shifts awesome.

WizardOfBoz

If it makes you feel any better, I recently ran my chain around the standoff on the RD brackets holding the guide and idler wheel. PhD in Engineeering. Seven years of working in a bike shop. And this wasn't even a subtlety like your issue! It may be that there's some idiocy lurking in all of us. Or maybe just a lot of idiocy in me.

A while back I decided to check out my front derailleur (Dura Ace FD-9000). With this model, same thing, you can run the cable one way (to the left or the right of the cable fixing bolt), and there is a little piece called a "converter" (what does it convert? from what, to what? Argggh) that you switch one way or the other, depending upon how you run your cable. A tool (TL-FD68) is used to ensure that you route the cable to the optimal side of the fixing bolt and set the converter correctly. A lot more complex than adjusting a campy nuovo record limit screw, then stretching the cable with some pliers, and tightening the fixing bolt!

I felt like an idiot, but then I read Lennard Zinn's take on this and the explanation was as complex as I thought it was. See here, for his excellent explanation. If it takes an expert like Zinn a few pages to explain, I realized that it is pretty (needlessly?) complex and perhaps I was not an idiot for being confused.

Glad you got it working.

chorlton

Bong! In my lack of experience the rear dérailleur has a bent bit of metal under the fixing nut and you route the cable under it. The front dérailleur has a similar bent bit of metal under the fixing nut and you have to route the cable over it. YMMV

hhnngg1

I'm not even joking when I say that I could have purchased BOTH Di2 AND e-Tap together at full list price, if I charged myself the normal wage rate I get paid at my job for the total number of hours I've spent installing and troubleshooting the groupset on one bike and updating the groupset on my internal cable routed 2nd bike.

And no, this isn't just a back door brag about how much I earn per hour - it's a sad reflection on how much time it took me to figure out and do all this bike work on my own without teachers/friends to help.

I wish I could say it was worth it, but honestly, I'm not sure. After I've installed my Tiagra, I've messed with it at least 10 separate times to 'improve' little niggles, yet for sure, when my LBS did it right the very first time, it was good and stayed good for 2 years with no adjustments.

All in all, I think it's probably ok worth it in the long run since I plan on riding/racing bikes for the next 20 years at least, but I think all the home bike wrenches on the forums HUGELY oversell the value of self-wrenching, either because they've forgotten the startup costs in time/cost to get the skillset, or they just like the idea of having others convert to their particular hobby.

I'd frankly much rather train and race my bike fast rather than spend hours troubleshooting shifters, derailleurs and brakes.

trailangel

Well, I actually don't think you make any money, as you are riding Tiagra.

"I'd frankly much rather train and race my bike fast rather than spend hours troubleshooting shifters, derailleurs and brakes."
Add waxing your chain to the waste of time, buddy.

hhnngg1

No way. Waxing SAVES tons of time, unless you enjoy riding with a black tattoo-bearing mess of a chain.

If you actually properly CLEAN your lubed chain, it'll take at LEAST 15 minutes, and you'll probably still have a pretty dirty chain as a result that will instantly leave chain tattoos despite the cleaning. ANd that's with a chain cleaning machine.

WIth the paraffin dip, it's turn on the crock pot for it to melt unattended for 20-30 mins, then pull the chain out of the hot wax, (cool if desired) and then mount with quicklink back on bike. Takes <5 minutes of time total not counting the crockpot heating time. And then your chain is for SURE super-clean. ZERO chain tattoos, and it actually stays that way as well.

You also can take your Tiagra snobbery elsewhere. My racing bike is a DA Cervelo, and the main thing I've learned from it is that DA is a waste of money. 105, and now, even 10-sp Tiagra is so close in function that it's all all ever need. I race that bike in triathlons and average 24mph for an hour with it (with the swim and run sandwiched around it), so it's also not like I'm pulling up the rear.

No joke as well - before the Tiagra, that bike had the entry level 2200/Sora drivetrain system on it, and it was REALLY good. Like buttery smooth shifting, and easy to adjust. I would still be using it today if the parts hadn't developed rust, and as well, I couldn't use my10spd racing Powertap hub with the 8-speed system (whereas the Tiagra group allows me to use my powertap wheel now.) If Shimano Sora were 10 speed, I seriously would have just cheaped out and put that one on my bike and called it a day, as it was so good. (You gotta be able to adjust it to get the most out of it, obviously.)

Well adjusted Sora >>> slightly off-adjusted DA any day for shifting performance.

sunburst

Thx for the link and page number. I see it applies to my Ultegra FD as well, so now I'm clued in if/when I replace the cable.

TimothyH

The docs are not perfect and one sometimes has to hunt for the right information but they are a start and helped me tremendously when was doing a frame up build with hydraulic brakes.

no motor?

Not a total waste, your experience helped me realize I'd done something similar with the RD. And now that shifts better, thanks for posting this!

70sSanO

Sorry for your waste of time, however you did learn something. But it probably pales in comparison to the hours you've spent posting over the years... just sayin'.

John

FBinNY 

The only problem here is your own stubbornness. Sometime after 15 minutes or so, you should have concluded that you were doing something wrong and considered the possibilities or sought more info or help.

Instead, you acted like someone lost in unfamiliar territory and refusing to consult a map or ask directions.

cny-bikeman

Wow, that autocorrect really has it out for you, FB! In what course was he enrolling?

FBinNY 

I don't remember what I typed that autocorrected to enrolling. Obviously I meant refusing, and went back and fixed it.

OTOH we could say the OP was enrolling in the school of hard knocks.

Duo

been there.

usually in a hurry or fatique. fortunately the cure is simple: sleep and bike manuals, or videos

be blessed