twm182

Hi folks, could anyone help me ID and provide any other info on this bike I picked up the other day? No "make" decal or head badge has made things quite frustrating. I'm planning a full overhaul/resto.

I'm fairly new to the C&V scene so please correct any info I already have if needed but go easy on me: )

I can't find any exact matches on the frame anywhere. Perhaps it was made by an individual frame builder? I picked up another bike from the same seller also without any decals or badge (I'll likely post pictures of it later. It was his wife's from the same time period but 531 tubes with campy dropouts and 600 Arabasque groupset).

Thanks!


Tange Champion tubes. Sakae handlebar.

Seems like the shape and polished fork crown is unique. Can't find any exact matches.


The lugs seen on the inside of the fork look just like pictures of Nishiki Pro ONP but some of the other lugs don't match


This serial number looks like some Centurions I have seen, but I can't match the frame to any models. I would assume this indicated 1977?

First generation DA. The pedals are Lyotard. That "Professional" decal is the only identifying decal.

The dropouts are Shimano





Ideale 80 Type Record

merziac

I have no idea but from the seat stay/lug, RDO and fork crown/tang treatment it seems like there should be a really good story here.

Looks very well made for having very production looking S/N.

What do I know?

jdawginsc 

Reminds me of a Fuji build at the top end, but the fork throws me off.

Velo Mule

Nice bike. The chrome accents on only the dropout and the fork crown are quite nice touches. Also interesting is that it has a "Professional" decal, the Tange tubing decals but no others. I am not an expert here, however, since you got me to respond with seeing this bike, I will speculate that it was bought as a frame only. This is based on the mix of Japanese and European parts. I noticed a Huret cable guide. I will further guess that it is Japanese made frame. Let's see what the real experts say.

The detail of the chainstay and seatstay on the rear dropout is done well and I haven't seen that look before. Then again, I'm not at the level of others around here.
It looks like Imron or high quality paint too.

thinktubes 

Fork may be a Tange 124

merziac

[MENTION=502994]twm182[/MENTION]

After another look, the outline of or painted over sticker at the bottom of the ST looks like the IMO crappy "made in Japan" sticker that I have always thought looked like an afterthought.

noobinsf 

I think this is a Miki-produced Centurion Professional from 1977, based on recent posts about this era Centurion Pro and T-Mar's serial number guide. Sweet bike, and I love the color!

It's quickly becoming a bike I want to find in my size (which yours is not).

noobinsf 

Well, there is this reference, which seems to tell a corroborating story, but that seat cluster is different.

Centurion Professional

Edit: I dunno — the more I see online, the less confident I am that I’m right.

grayEZrider

Having owned three models of Centurion (no Pro) and original catalogs I agree.
And like you still watching for a Pro in my size!

Addamsmith

love it beautiful colour

SurferRosa

How to make me scroll a lot more in every thread with a bunch of redundant pics?

I mean, c'mon, man!

twm182

Thanks for the replies, everyone. I've got a few other questions too...

noobinsf ive seen a couple 1977 Professionals online but they differ from my bike in that either the fork, lugs, or decal are different. Is it possible that what I saw online were just not made in Miki and therefore slightly different? I figure regardless it was likely sold as just the frame?

When overhauling, if the bottom bracket is smooth and in good shape is there any reason to service? Possible servicing regardless may help with longevity? Or should I not try to fix what's not broken?

Any tips on reviving that saddle? Or is it just as easy as liberally applying conditioner? Favorite brands?

Lastly, any ideas on how much something like this would be worth? eBay or locally in a metro area? (I may very well keep it and ride it, but it'd be good to have a rough idea).

Thanks!

noobinsf 

That reference I linked to says production moved from Mexico to Japan in 1977, so I suppose it's possible the first year of production used different lugs, but I'm by no means an expert on these bikes. The seat cluster and lugs look different to me, though the fork crown looks the same. This is why I said the more I look online, the less certain I am. Whatever it is, it's a very nice bike, and I look forward to what more informed folks have to say. Maybe Miki produced for other brands? I know there are folks on these forums who can answer that definitively.

As for the bottom bracket -- yes, you should service it if you don't when it was last done. With the right tools, it's pretty straightforward, and there is a lot of advice online if you need it.

merziac

What ever conditioner you use, go easy with. You don't want to over do it, it can cause them to lose shape.

I would encourage you to overhaul the BB, then you will know its good for sure.

merziac

Then my work is done here, oh wait a minute, no its not.

non-fixie 

Yes they did. One of those brands was Union (Dutch). Their Sapporo model was made by Miki:

79pmooney

The saddle - don't use neatsfoot oil or mink oil unless you absolutely have to . Use Proofhide or Snowseal. Those first two can cause permanent stretching and weakining of the leather.

The bottom bracket - I would service it from the non-drive side and leave the drive cup in place until I felt justified in taking on a challenge of unknown proportions. (Let sleeping dogs be until there is a reason to wake them.)

Nice bike! Enjoy it. I raced a Fuji Pro of roughly the era and quality and loved it.

twm182

79pmooney I've got some Proofhide I'll use

thinktubes that fork looks spot on!

Seems like most people think it's a 1977 Centurion Professional. I know Sekai made a "Professional" model that year, but not sure if they made any in Miki.

I guess it's not always possible to perfectly ID a frame from this era?

Biketiger

Wow - you guys are GOOD. My best guess was made in Japan because of the Shimano dropouts and the circles cut into the inside of the fork lugs - I've seen that on Makino and Nagasawas too.