DXchulo

Rider 1 is followed by Rider 2. A car passes from behind and maybe 150 feet ahead signals to turn left into a driveway. The coast is clear for the car, but it comes to a complete stop. Rider 1 starts to pass the car, and then the car starts turning. Rider 1 stops and rider 2 collides with Rider 1's rear wheel. Rider 2 goes down while Rider 1 stays upright.

GP

The bikes were going to pass the car on the left? Rider 2.

LesterOfPuppets

1. Passing someone on the left when they have their left turn signal on is completely idiotic.
2. Following someone who's doing #1 is completely idiotic

Tough call on who's at fault on the rearending incident. Knowing the answers to these questions might help.
Whaddya mean by following? Drafting? Did the front rider know the rear rider is there? Did the lead rider signal a stop?

Both riders are such idiots, they should find better things to worry about than who's fault that was.

Tulex

Why am I not seeing where he said they were passing on the left?

LesterOfPuppets

I suppose they may have passed on the right. I always assume passing is done to the left in left-hand drive countries. I'll add that to my list of questions that need to be answered.

And perhaps add... was this 2-lane blactop? Was there a bike lane or a shoulder?

njkayaker

So, the car turns left and the cyclists try to pass on the right.

Were the two cyclists riding in a pace line?

Why did the first one stop?

Why didn't the first one slow down sooner?

Tsuru

Sounds like Rider 1 was going to pass the turning car (I'm assuming on the right of it) but because the car stopped, decided it was best to stop instead? I'm guessing Rider 1 didn't drop a hand to let Rider 2 know he was slowing/stopping?

awesomejack

wait, why did rider 1 stop? The car was turning left, and the riders were on the right side of the car, they didn't need to stop.

I would say its rider 1's fault because they stopped unexpectedly and for no reason

Tunnelrat81

There's really no excuse for trying to pass a car on the side that it's blinker is signalling. I know that we all hate to slow down and sacrifice momentum, and that it's satisfying to be able to react quickly (and appropriately) to be able to maintain that momentum through a momentary distraction but.... THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR PASSING A VEHICLE ON THE SIDE THAT IT'S SIGNALLING TO TURN!!

That said, there is also no excuse for fixating your gaze on the rider in front with complete disregard to what's coming at you from up the road. Riding with others can sometimes cause us to release some of the personal responsibility that we would have while riding solo, which is dangerous and risky. Just because the guy in front of you didn't signal that there was an upcoming stop sign or light (or turning vehicle) is no excuse to rear-end him when he slows for it. We all do our best to signal back info about approaching obstacles etc, but it's also everyone's individual responsibility to pay attention to what's going on, for the sake of EVERYONE'S safety.

This is not a story about a crash that resulted from a freak occurrence like a small animal unable to be seen by the rider following, but a vehicle, with brake lights and blinkers being used. If you can't pay enough attention to a 'SIGNALLING' car, how on earth are you going to have time to respond to the large percentage of drivers who don't use their blinkers? Rider 1, think about what it means to ride recklessly before getting back on your bike, and Rider 2, pay freaking attention! It's on both of you. I'm sorry if that's not the answer you were hoping for.

-Jeremy

Tulex

IF the car is on the right side turning left, so across the road, and you guys are passing on the right of the car, there is nothing wrong with that, and it's legal, at least in NY.
IF 2 is familiar with how 1 rides, and 2 has reason to expect 1 to do the above, and he doesn't, 2 should ask 1 what the hell he was thinking.
IF 2 is not familiar with how 1 rides, 2 is at fault.

edit to fix left to right

palookabutt

Rider 2 is completely at fault. Watch where the hell you're going and you won't hit stuff.

DXchulo

Just to clarify, they were passing on the left. It was a country road with no shoulder, so there wouldn't have been room to try to pass on the right. I think Rider 1 thought the car stopped to let them pass. I didn't see him come to a complete stop, but it looked like one of those things where you roll at 3 mph instead of stopping & unclipping.

theREEDeffect

Ohh, no. The pass on the left was the wrong decision even if it seemed the car was stopping to let the bikes pass.

m603

It's no one's fault, it's a accident..... it happens!

Caad 8

I agree.

Is this how it was set up?

awesomejack

Ohh, now it makes sense.

Both riders are complete idiots. The one in front should not have tried to pass the car and the one in back should have been paying attention

Yaniel

If I'm following someone and I see any possible obstacle like a stopped car coming up, I open up a gap just in case something unexpected happens. I blame rider 2.

stedalus

Both riders screwed up. Rider 1 shouldn't have tried to pass on the left, even if he thought the car was letting them through, and Rider 2 shouldn't have followed. At that point, both riders put themselves into a dangerous situation, so the resulting crash is on both of them.

zonatandem

Law states: You must be in control of your vehicle. Rider #2 apparently was not in control

Phil85207

I AM SO CONFUSED! I Got A headache. I am going to take an aspirin.

MegaTom

Assuming that this was a pace line scenario, both riders share equal blame.

A) Rider 1 shouldn't have attempted to pass on the left side of a vehicle that was signaling a left turn.
B) Rider 2 shouldn't have attempted to pass on the left side of a vehicle that was signaling a left turn..... even if he was following Rider 1.
C) When riding in a pace line, it is understood that there is a risk of crashing if any rider takes sudden or unforeseen action. Any fault that Rider 1 might have had due to suddenly stopping without signal or warning in the middle of the pace line is mitigated by the fact that Rider 2 was foolish enough to follow Rider 1's attempt to pass on the left side of a vehicle that was signaling a left turn.



However, if the riders were not riding in a pace line - Rider 2 is at fault for riding too closely to Rider 1 to control/stop his self in case of sudden or unforeseen circumstances.

Gorden Gekko

Costello: Well then who's on first?

Abbott: Yes.

Costello: I mean the fellow's name.

Abbott: Who.

Costello: The guy on first.

Abbott: Who.

Costello: The first baseman.

pdedes

under our provinces insurance rules, the onus is on the following vehicle. therefore, rider #2. if rider 1 completes the pass, rider 1 is guilty of an illegal pass.

ls01

I am going to say the parents of both of the cyclists. They should hang thier heads in shame.

merlinextraligh

As a legal matter, the concept of "unavoidable accident" is going away, and has been rejected in numerous jurisdictions.

As a practical matter, "its an accident, no one's at fault" is a liccense to ride unsafely.

In this case passing a car on the left, that signalling a left turn is 1) illegal, and 2) potentially deadly.

Hitting a vehicle in front of you is also illegal.

There's a fair amount of fault to go around in this scenario.

And saying it's an accident and no one is at fault is a cop out, potentially a deadly cop out.