dasgib

I used to get pretty jazzed about watching the points and KOM competitions. Now, I have stopped seeing their value. At the end, what are we rewarding? - the ability to effectively game the rules.

I think a reworking of the points allocation is required so that at the end, the Green jersey winner can say they are best sprinter in the race. Likewise with the KOM.

Sacrilegious?

Quel

The jerseys give incentive for people to attack at multiple points in the race, so they keep it interesting even when the GC times aren't changing. That's it. I think it works out well that way. The pure sprinters have their stage wins, and the strongest climbers have their GC hopes.

deadprez012

Um...what are we talking about in this thread? Not a sarcastic thing, I really have no idea.

tollhousecookie

I think these guys are only after the cash. Who would wear one of those silly shirts in public?

dasgib

I hear you, but do people really get excited about a couple of guys doing line sprints? Or someone popping off the front of a long break to take a few KOM points?

Riders are already incented to shake things up when things are dull - he most combative rider award, T.V. face time etc.

I think we should have the jerseys reflect something meaningful, that's all.

umd

:facepalm:

dasgib

Facepalm? Sacrilegious, then?

tollhousecookie

Dosen't the ends justify the means? These guys want to kiss the pretty girls. But, You are right... never heard Phil get too giddy about calling a points sprint.

umd

It's not my fault you don't understand things.

flaco

How is it possible to do anything other than 'game' a sport? Anyway, the rules are what separate sports from mere feats of athletic ability.

tollhousecookie

Plus, they wouldn't change the way they do things even if you had a better idea. But they will xray your bike!

merlinextraligh

The green points jersey is pretty well scored, with the winner being the most consistent finisher. The intermediate sprint points are often meaningless due to early breakaways, but they're not enough points to distort the competition.

The KOM competition, however, doesn't usually identify the best climbers in the race because you can win it with early attacks ala Virenque, or Jalabert.

The Tour addressed this somewhat with double points on the final climb of the day. But there still might be a way to tweak it to better identify the true climbers.

At any rate, both competitions are added dimensions to the race that increase fan interest, and add complexity to the strategy of the race.

For example, even if your goal has nothing to do with either the Points or KOM competition, you still have to figure on the motivations of other riders/teams, who are competing for those jerseys in designing your tactics.

The interplay of all the competitions, and how it affects tactics is one of the things that makes the race intriguing.

superdex

thread saved by merlin

guadzilla

Why? He has a point - dont agree with it, but I can see the point nonetheless. It is a legit question, especially for someone new.

under18cyclists

Because.

umd

not really

Chris_F

I like the green jersey. I can't seem to get in to the polka dot. They should make the polka dot jersey the "longest wheelie" jersey and award points to the rider who's able to ride the longest wheelie. Just to make it interesting, other riders should be able to push him over.

dasgib

You know, you haven't actually said anything, but you have spent the time anyway.

What did we learn about Thor last year, other than he made a very cagey move with his long distance attack in a category 2 / 3 zone? Can we say anything about his attributes as a rider other than being a smart rider and pretty good sprinter?

I am not saying we should do away with the jersey's, I am saying some modification could maintain the interest, maintain sponsoring opportunities AND reward some identifiable attributes of riders.

dasgib

I think you are right actually, w.r.t. the points jersey, but there is something about rewarding clever, but consistently second best sprinter that seems odd.

Quel

Quit stealing botto's schtick.

umd

Any kind of overall competition is going to reward consistency, not the "best". Even the yellow jersey doesn't usually win stages. The idea that you can "game" the competition is absurd, the competition is to get the most points. Those of you complaining probably just think cav should be winnin the green jersey, but he won't as long as all he does is wheelsuck and sprint the last 200m.

dasgib

I agree that the yellow jersey presents some problems for my argument, but at least with the yellow, we can say that at the end of the day the winner covered the distance in the shortest time.

I just don't know what we say about the points and KOM winners at the end of the day. Perhaps the green jersey is the best classics rider in the Tour?

shovelhd

These are pros. There is money involved. I don't see the problem unless you think these races are only about the spectator.

dasgib

I think most pros would agree that the sport is all about the spectator. Where do you think the money is coming from? They pool their personal resources?

merlinextraligh

Floyd could get a Pro Tour contract again. Dude could wheelie.