cholly

On your road bike, anyone ever go to a fatter tire (28-32ish) and lower psi and then decide that thin is still in?

Are there still those that don't follow the 'science' and CRR stats and say -- I like it firm, thin, and fast (at least the perceived feeling of fast)?

I will certainly agree that wider is more comfortable, but for a go-fast bike where I limit rides to 20-30 miles per ride, on good and bad tarmac -- am I missing something?

Thanks!

Wildwood 

My typical road ride is 20-30 MI. My preference is 22 -27mm tubulars or higher end clinchers. I have 30&33mm for rides with substantial sections of light gravel. Have yet to mount a pair of 38mm Herse tires = Barlow Pass on a 30lb ebike.

Iride01 

If you are happy with it then that's all that really matters. We are allowed to do our own thing. Now if you want to say you are better than any other, then you will have to prove it.

Though many will be uneasy with you not doing what they do. It's okay if they can't deal with it.

I'm still on 25mm tires. I might go to 28mm sometime this year.

Maelochs

I was a proponent of "thinnest/hardest" for a very long time. I do not find I am any slower on 28s at 90 or so than 23s at 125 or so .....

The "science" is actually Science ... as in, people did a lot of tests and found that on anything but a board track (or a machined metal drum on a tire-tester) the softer tires offered less rolling resistance because they didn't chatter and bounce.

I weigh a huge amount, so I still run my tires firm--I hate even a little squirming on corners ..... and I still have 23s on two bikes .... but I fully understand that I would probably be marginally faster on 28s there .... but at my age and pace any sort of marginal gain is too marginal. I can afford to lose a few seconds an hour .... I am no racer. That said, when I run out of my stock of 23s I might move upwards. if I lose no speed and gain comfort , and possibly even gain a minuscule amount of speed .... why not?

But as @Iride01 says ....

Kai Winters

Interesting how technology changes with the times. Back in the '80's I did time trials using 19mm sewups aired up to 140psi...Conti Sprinters I think but not quite sure. It was like riding on a steel rail and sketchy in corners but I managed 28.5avg mph in a 40km New England Regional Time Trial Champs but only good enough for a bronze medal in the masters 35 cat.

I currently ride an Aethos and use Vittoria Corsa's 25mm. Ride wonderfully and at 64kg I don't need more imo.

shelbyfv

I never experienced a downside, real or imagined, when moving up to 28s. I've since moved to 32s and beyond in pursuit of comfort and stability but can see that might not suit everyone. I don't know why anyone would prefer a 23 to a 28 if they have clearance.

Jughed

I dunno - my senses must be dull after years of hard living.

I really can't tell the difference between 25's and 28's - or 23's for that matter.

smd4

I'm one of those guys. I run my 23 mm Veloflexes at 140 PSI. I find no need to change them.

It seems like people think wider tires are faster. But even Rene Herse only says this: ​​​​​​​

Why Wider Tires are NOT Slower

smd4

If you can't tell the difference, then why ride a heavier tire?

79pmooney

I rode sewups for decades starting in the early '70s. Absolutely loved them. On all my bikes. Widths in general were not listed but none (except Clement Del Mondos) not wide. Pressures 100 to 115. Married and switched to clinchers. (Easier than justifying the cost and time of sewups. Choosing my battles ...) Started at 23s. 25s seemed better. 28s worked better in the wet and winter. 32s found their way to new to me bikes that liked gravel.

I began to think that my love of skinny sewups was the fond memories of a fictional youth. Just like my love for the 75 degree head angle, super short chainstay criterium bike I took down some of Vermont's fastest decents. Two summers ago I picked up an early '80s Japanese race bike. Same size and nearly the same geometry of that old race bike. And just as tight. Big tires cannot even be put on. Takes to hands to spin the wheels on the stand with "normal" rubber. 25c max in front, 24c max in back.

Now it happened I picked up that bike the same time I had decided to go back to sewups. The return to sewups was for peace of mind and had nothing to do with performance or bike limitations. A dozen years ago I blew an old clincher and it came off the rim. That crash was one of my top five and afterwards I could not enjoy a fast decent, always thinking "I'm going 45. That crash was at 25. What if the tire blows?" (I blew a sewup at least once at that speed in my racing days. Braked to a stop using both brakes, peeled the tire off, put the spare on and rode on. Yes, I remember the heartrate jump when the tire blew. But the rest was such a non-event that I cannot remember where it happened, which wheel it was or even if it happened once or on two occasions. That clincher blowout will be imprinted in my brain for as long as I live.

So, early on I built up sewup wheels for this old race bike. Took me a while to find 23c tubulars so the bike didn't get ridden much. But last summer I knew I was riding it for Cycle Oregon's last ever week long ride and landed a 23c Vittoria Corsa for that rear tire. I started the ride a little nervous about doing descents in the coast range with rubber that skinny. Well Day 2 was it. And I encountered a stretch of about 20 feet of missing pavement; basically an extended pothole bottom, at real speed. I just tightened my grip on the drops but not my forearms and lifted maybe a 1/4" out of the saddle and let the bike do its thing underneath me. Like I was a 25 yo racer. Bike blasted along, hit the 2" far "pothole lip", bounced up onto the pavement and rolled on like that was nothing. And me? "This bike? Yeah!!" Never worried about pavement after that.

Oh, I weigh 150 pounds. Rode the front 25c Corsa at 95 psi, the rear 23c at 110. Very nice GP4 rims I didn't want to hit and dent. So, yes, enough pressure that this was not a modern ride of big, low pressure (comfortable) tires. But the ride was - sublime. Two of the days were just pure bliss on the bike. One with headwind in farm country, dead flat. Morale killer except the bike felt so wonderful.

The are several things that will keep me from putting tires this skinny on my other bikes. Biggest - I have to pay more attention. Skinny tires drop into cracks wide tires roll over. Stones on the pavement are a bigger issue. So is dirt, debris and leaves. At 70 yo, bigger and softer often feels like what I want. (But squishy drives me nuts. And I need decent firmness in the front tire when I come out of the saddle and pull myself forward over those 150mm stems.) My Mooney is a Cadillac set up fix gear with 28c Corsas. Might even see 30s one day. The TiCycle is also running 28s. Jessica, the fix gear of my avatar, feels perfect on 25s. She was built to handle 25 max in back running the wheel all the way forward with a 24 tooth cog. With quality sewups, she doesn't need a mm more. (She is a race bike, fictional yes but still ... Not paying attentions while riding her is never going to end up well.)

Edit: And yes, light wheels are fun! Really light wheels are more fun. Tubular wheels are the way to light wheels on a low budget. With low tech aluminum rims that work with rim brakes in the wet and handle the heat of braking on descents well.

icemilkcoffee 

I went from 25 to 28's on my old Performance Focus and Centurion Ironman. I could definitely feel the ride was cushier. Especially the 'open tubular' Soma Supple Vitesse SL - these were exceptionally smooth riding at 28mm. With my current Look KG96 I started out on 28mm, but then soon decided that 28mm really doesn't look quite right on a classic frame. It looks too fat. I went back to 25mm Conti GP4000, and guess what- I barely noticed the difference- it rode just as good. On my KHS ZH2B Aero I can only fit a 23mm Veloflex Corsa in the back, along with 25mm in the front. These are very supple 'open tubular' tires. Much to my surprise, the ride is very, very good. Much better than anyone would expect with the tear-drop shaped tubing, aluminum fork, and deep section carbon Hed wheels. At the moment I do have 28mm tires on my Trek Y-Foil, but that's just because they happen to be the only tires I have on hand when I was putting that bike together. I think I'll go back to 25 eventually. I think 25 is the sweet spot for tubed clinchers. With the current crop of 'open tubulars' I think the traditional harsh ride associated with skinny tires is tempered to a good degree.
The real advantage of 28 tires, is that you can go longer between inflating the tires. At 80psi, the air leaks out more slowly than at 90-100psi.

Jughed

Good question. Very good question.

CAT7RDR

I'm waiting for a definitive answer from Larry.
Then, the thread will have credence.

Wildwood 

. Agree with not liking heavy tires on non-commuter, non-tandem applications.

The idea is to run a slightly wider tire, hopefully not much heavier. And a bit taller. As because - the real world of roads hold ruts and cracks and imperfections. The larger tire may provide a safer ride in such conditions, if only marginally. Small margins can matter at 20mph in a bike lane with traffic close. Likewise for gravel, wider offers safer.

Unfortunately, the price of lightweight supple road/all roads tires is not cheap.

Koyote

Wait a minute: aren't you on a (heavy) old steel frame?

smd4

I think I tried to explain this to you before. Maybe someone else. Maybe it's a difficult point to grasp, I don't know.

First, I ride a lightweight old steel frame, not a heavy one. Second, I'm not trying to ride the lightest bike possible. (I have an old Bicycling magazine from 2015 that talks about a 10.5 lbs Trek--I'm not looking to buy one). Third, I am trying to make the bike I own as light as possible. Have you ever tried to do that?

Wildwood 

Do you ever ride roads consisting of chipseal? Even at my advanced age, on such roads, my hands/wrists can tell the difference between a 22mm Conti Sprinter and a 25mm Veloflex Arenberg when both are pumped to 120psi (8.5bar). 28s at 100psi are better on coarse chipseal.

rosefarts

I’m not impressed with wider road tires for my level of riding. Both of my older (1985 and. 2001) road bikes can fit 28. The newer one even has an extra wheelset that is tubeless compatible.

I’ve tried it and went back to tubed 25’s with Conti race tubes. It’s lighter than any tubeless setup. I find it comfortable but magnets stick to my bikes. For the lower miles these bikes get, I’m very happy with that setup. Most road rims are 14-18mm internal, no need to cram a huge tire on that.

My gravel bike has 38’s and my next set will be 43, and my MTB will get to 2.5 or 2.6 this spring. There’s a time and place for all this stuff.

terrymorse 

For several years, decades before it became "cool" to ride fat tires, I was using 28mm Avocet slick tires, at 70-75 psi. They rode fine, and they allowed me to ride confidently off the pavement.

When I got a new road bike with tight clearances, I switched to 23 mm tires at 100-105 psi. They worked just fine, too, but not so well in the dirt.

Today I am using 25 mm tires at 85-90 psi. They are also just fine.

Until I decide to do some off road riding, I'm happy staying with 25 mm.

Jughed

No chipseal here that I can think of. Most of our roads are decent, much of my riding is on a canal path - very smooth asphalt.

One of the roads I frequent has many cracks in the asphalt that make for a rough ride - but I can't really feel the difference between 25's and 28's, and honestly (I've said this on other threads), my CX bike with 37mm tires at 70psi rides rougher than all of my bikes... It has fatter soft tires, a "flexy" seat post, CF frame - I can feel the crap ride on that bike, but not the slight difference in tire size on my road bike.

Erzulis Boat 

Depends on the rim width, but my sweet spot currently is 25-28. On some 17mm rims, 25 works great, but with wider, like 23mm width, a 28 tire is the minimum, as the mounted profile is too "low" (pinch flats).

I run from 90 to 110 PSI.

3alarmer 

.
...most of my dry weather bikes have 700x25's on them currently. Those I mostly inflate to 120-130 psi. I do have some wet weather setups with fenders, and on those I use wider tires, like 28's or 32's. If I rode regularly on rougher surfaces, I would certainly use wider tires, even in dry weather.

seypat

I'm strictly a road rider. I have many bikes. At one time I had the same brand of tire from 23s to 32s on various wheelsets. I'd switch them between bikes and see if I could tell much difference. The 32s feel sluggish compared to the 23s. Other than that, not much of a difference. I usually buy the cheapest size within a particular brand. That usually means 25s. BTW, I'm no lightweight, so no low pressures for me.

SurferRosa

Absolutely. I prefer 25s, even if they measure more narrow than that. A couple of my road frames can't even fit a 28 (not that I would use them).

But I still have a 28mm rear on my road bike that's the designated grocery getter.

Polaris OBark

I have 38mm tires on my road bike.

Funny you should mention this, as I was reading the following last night:

https://www.renehersecycles.com/intr...-orondo-grade/